Essex
Super Anarchist
A nice little arch with trav mounted on top might be the trick here. Can hang a few cup holders on it too.
The coolest performance cruiser on the planet
- Thread starter Schakel
- Start date
Marinatrix447
Anarchist
*Maybe get rid of the mast too*
Life without a chase boat?!?...Ghastly.... only way to provision of a morning..... jeez!
Life without a chase boat?!?...Ghastly.... only way to provision of a morning..... jeez!
On the X the traveler was cleated by a standard clam cleat to windward (as in racing yachts). I cannot stop my kids sometimes wandering into places they are told not to (which is why electric winches are generally off with young kids onboard). I value my kids safety more than a touch more power to windward in light winds. It clearly looked like an accident waiting to happen on a cruising boat.
Not to mention twisted ankles in the deep groove, the track is not proud of the deck.
Everyone has different uses and priorities for their boats.
daan62
Super Anarchist
started on a boat at the age of 3 weeks... do do's and no no's are quickly taught at a young age... yes, there were accidents... but you learned from the situations... (my parenents are still talking about the time i fell down approximately 1,5 meters on the back of my life vest (oldschool orange shit) into the pit (somewhere about the age of 3-4...(mom's comment: you sounded like an air alarm, so at least the basics were OK))
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shaggybaxter
Super Anarchist
Geez, I dunno Sweya, I have a full length traveller and have had bucketloads of newbies and kids onboard and never killed anyone.
For me a traveller does more for safety than it doesn't in giving you proper control of your sail trim. 30 degrees heel isn't real comfortable for your passengers, and I'm much more likely to have someone hurt from excessive heel and wave action than I am with catching them with the traveller.I can take the boat from that to 10 degrees with the traveller without moving from the helm in seconds, using a main sheet to do the same thing makes the boat handle like crap compared to still being in control with room to spare.
Absolutely an uncleated traveller can be dangerous, but follow that thread and one can argue so is putting up sails. My traveller cleats are deck mounted next to each helm, they have have never just uncleated.
On a boat that big, my safety focus would be on how I can recover from the mainsheet coming apart. A big boom and a set mainsail without a sheet swinging widly, will it take out the sidestays? What hardpoints do I have, where can I stand safely and lasso it and restrain it? Can I still reach the helm? Halyard? Or the liferaft? Does the design mean there is 10kgs of metal blocks flaying around with the snapped mainsheet?
Cheers!
SB
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shaggybaxter
Super Anarchist
A tell for me is detail like a preventer. A well thought out preventer design would mitigate, or even resolve, this exact thing. Sadly, this is where my design falls from function to asthetics and convenience as it goes to the side decks rather than the bow.
The angle made between the boom and the sidedeck hardpoint hopelessly reduces the breaking strain compared to a traditional bow mounted preventer. No way could a design like mine with hardpoints on the sidedecks constrain a swinging boom, the angle just kills it.
From the bow? Absolutely. There are things that shouldn't be sacrificed for convenience, even though every boat is a blend of comfort v legs and safety.
Edit: Probably a bad example as you can always rig a new preventer. The point is at this price point and target market, one shouldn't have to fit shit like this post purchase. That's why they cost more.
The angle made between the boom and the sidedeck hardpoint hopelessly reduces the breaking strain compared to a traditional bow mounted preventer. No way could a design like mine with hardpoints on the sidedecks constrain a swinging boom, the angle just kills it.
From the bow? Absolutely. There are things that shouldn't be sacrificed for convenience, even though every boat is a blend of comfort v legs and safety.
Edit: Probably a bad example as you can always rig a new preventer. The point is at this price point and target market, one shouldn't have to fit shit like this post purchase. That's why they cost more.
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Hawaiidart
Anarchist
Shaggybaxter makes good points. In Hawaii's tradewinds, we often played the traveller instead of the sheet. It's much easier and quicker under a load and less tiresome for the trimmer. I cannot image the ease-hike-trim routine of big breeze sailing in a keel boat by constantly manipulating the sheet unless you have Popeye on crack as crew.
jack_sparrow
Super Anarchist
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Yep and boom will lift when hitting water and not bust shit.
Hint. Use dynamic (elastic) cordage to take the shock out.
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shaggybaxter
Super Anarchist
Quick glance:
- I'd have a mainsheet constraint under the boom no more than a few feet forrard of that rear block. If the rear block comes apart from the boom I still have mainsheet control, albeit heavier.
- I'd take the lower block off the traveller car and tether the mainsheet to the car. No block on the end of a swinging mainsheet if it comes apart. The chances of a good quality car coming off a track is near zero. The chance of a block coming off a car is more likely, and preventable.
Edit: which means redesign the mainsheet to move the ratio somewhere else ...etc etc
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jack_sparrow
Super Anarchist
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Sail4beer
Starboard!
Another hint. Pass on the boat and get a proven boat with a good track record.
It appears to be sailed by two sailors with a little knowledge. Young and pretty but not exactly killing it to windward so the promotional photographer can get a few money shots of the hot chick on a fast boat.
Left Shift
Super Anarchist
The crew is hiding below decks, like all the sexy photographs in magazines.
But the real issue is:
I have been racing and cruising sailboats for about 5 decades, owned a dozen or so from 15' to 50', raced across a couple of oceans, charter skippered in the Caribbean, won a few things here and there....and, while I've used a downhaul, a down-fucker, and a vang and a gnav, I have NEVER heard of a "downholder".
What the fuck is a "down-holder"????? And WHY?
jack_sparrow
Super Anarchist
- 37,393
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daan62
Super Anarchist
daan62
Super Anarchist
Do you remember SORC days the old IOR 2 ton (I know, I know, take it to the other thread...)?
Where packing sea-sickness pills for crossing the gulf stream during the ocean triangle was a requirement? Where you gobbled a white one to settle the motion sickness, and then immediately took two brown ones to keep you awake? Or was it two white ones and one brown one? And anyway, all we ever took were the brown ones because what self respecting ocean racer ever admitted to mal de mer? And how we were able to complete the race without having to enter a watch cycle?
Well, the white pills were the up-chuckles and the brown pills were the down-holders.
I think...
Where packing sea-sickness pills for crossing the gulf stream during the ocean triangle was a requirement? Where you gobbled a white one to settle the motion sickness, and then immediately took two brown ones to keep you awake? Or was it two white ones and one brown one? And anyway, all we ever took were the brown ones because what self respecting ocean racer ever admitted to mal de mer? And how we were able to complete the race without having to enter a watch cycle?
Well, the white pills were the up-chuckles and the brown pills were the down-holders.
I think...
TUBBY
Anarchist
Shaggy, a system that worked well on a well thought out boat from the past.
A permanently rigged wire (yes it was that long ago), from the outboard end of the boom.
When not in use it was held at the gooseneck by a short length of shock cord wit a hook into the thimble swaged into that end of the wire.
When required disconnect the shock cord and lead outside the shrouds to the kicker which then gave easy control of the preventer from the cockpit & a forward angle with minimum mucking around.
The Dark Knight
Super Anarchist
