The Future of Budget Cuts?

Jim M

Super Anarchist
19,069
0
Qu'ils mangent de la brioche that attitude started a big one, may start another. Richest country per capita and we cannot help the lesser of us.

"INDIANAPOLIS — Indiana's budget crunch has become so severe that some state workers have suggested leaving severely disabled people at homeless shelters if they can't be cared for at home, parents and advocates said.

They said workers at Indiana's Bureau of Developmental Disabilities Services have told parents that's one option they have when families can no longer care for children at home and haven't received Medicaid waivers that pay for services that support disabled people living independently.

Marcus Barlow, a spokesman for the Family and Social Services Administration, the umbrella agency that includes the bureau, said suggesting homeless shelters is not the agency's policy and workers who did so would be disciplined.

However, Becky Holladay of Battle Ground, Ind., said that's exactly what happened to her when she called to ask about the waiver she's seeking for her 22-year-old son, Cameron Dunn, who has epilepsy, autism and attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.

Holladay, a school nurse, said she and her husband would go bankrupt trying to pay for services themselves, so Cameron spends most days sitting in his stepfather's truck while he works as a municipal employee.

"It's heart-wrenching as a parent to watch it. We are people and they are people," Holladay said, referring to her son and others with disabilities. "They have lives that are worth something."

There have been no confirmed cases of families dumping severely disabled people at homeless shelters because Indiana wouldn't provide the care needed.

But some families have been on waiting lists for waivers for 10 years. The lists contained more than 20,000 names last month, and one advocacy group predicted they will only grow longer because Gov. Mitch Daniels ordered budget cuts that have eliminated 2,000 waiver slots since July.

Budget cuts also have resulted in the state moving foster children with disabilities to a lower cost program that doesn't provide services for special needs and eliminating a grocery benefit for hundreds of developmentally disabled adults.

Kim Dodson, associate executive director of The Arc of Indiana, said her group has received reports of state workers in several of BDDS's eight regional offices telling families to take disabled adults to homeless shelters. She speculated that the suggestion resulted from frustration among BDDS staff as families become more outspoken about the effects of state cuts.

"It is something we are hearing from all over the state, that families are being told this is an alternative for them," Dodson said. "A homeless shelter would never be able to serve these people.""

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39879832/ns/us_news-life/

 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
64,011
6,390
De Nile
gotta push the responsibility to the local level - cause they know how to deal with this most effectively. Right...

 
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mikewof

mikewof
45,868
1,249
Holladay, a school nurse, said she and her husband would go bankrupt trying to pay for services themselves, so Cameron spends most days sitting in his stepfather's truck while he works as a municipal employee.
Cripes, that's the saddest thing I've read all week.

 
Yeah right Mikey. And the Aussie Abos used to leave their disabled or mixed race kids under a tree and walk away ASAP after birth.

But you'd know all about that wouldn't you.

 

Dawg

Moderator
7,862
1
Gee, it was either cut services to the disabled or (gasp!) raise the age at which state employees can retire with full pension to over 55!
I think the $720 million they spent on Lucas stadium for the Colts had something to do with it.

Funny how the State Employee Unions won't give an inch of their beloved benefits that private sector workers only dream about.

Boy I can see a Revolution coming and I would not want to be a public sector employee.

 

Mark K

Super Anarchist
47,621
1,868
Gee, it was either cut services to the disabled or (gasp!) raise the age at which state employees can retire with full pension to over 55!
I think the $720 million they spent on Lucas stadium for the Colts had something to do with it.

Funny how the State Employee Unions won't give an inch of their beloved benefits that private sector workers only dream about.

Boy I can see a Revolution coming and I would not want to be a public sector employee.
Yes. The pensions will be under a lot of pressure. The unions will probably be given a choice, cuts in employment or cuts in pensions. The math has become too difficult. The money just isn't there.

 

whitehall

Anarchist
839
19
Yes. The pensions will be under a lot of pressure. The unions will probably be given a choice, cuts in employment or cuts in pensions. The math has become too difficult. The money just isn't there.
For many states, the answer is to admit reality, declare bankruptcy, and shift pension math to the PBGC (Federal Pension Benefit Guarantee Corp).

It won't happen for a variety of reasons, of course, but just imagine an average public sector worker waking up to this, as many in the private sector have:

Q. How can I find out if my pension plan is underfunded?

 

A. Your plan administrator is required to give you an annual written notice regarding the funded status of the plan. That or perhaps read a damned newspaper. Your state is OBVIOUSLY bankrupt.

 

Q. When does PBGC terminate a pension plan?

 

A. PBGC can do so if, for example, a plan will be unable to pay benefits when due. Meaning PBGC should be knocking on your state's door, or certainly mine, within the next 2 minutes.

 

 

Q. What benefits does PBGC guarantee?

 

A. The pension benefit PBGC pays depends on (1) provisions of your plan, (2) legal limits, (3) the form of your benefit, (4) your age, (5) plan assets Oops!and (6) amounts (if any) PBGC recovers from employers for plan underfunding.

 

 

Q. Can I earn additional benefits after my plan’s termination date?

 

A. No. You cannot earn additional benefits after your plan terminates. Huh? Not even for School Superintendents????

 

 

Q. What is the maximum amount that PBGC can guarantee by law?

 

A. For 2009 and 2010, the maximum guaranteed amount is $4,500.00 per month ($54,000.00 per year) for workers who begin receiving payments from PBGC at age 65.The maximum guarantee is lower if you begin receiving payments from PBGC before age 65. Oh-oooh. That's gonna put a cramp on the retirement budget of one of our local veteran drivers ed teachers, currently slated to retire on twice that amount...

 

Guvmint pensions were originally designed on the premise of arguably below-market wages in exchange for arguably above-market pensions & other benefits. That balance got out of whack, is bankrupting us, and will end in some (ugly) fashion. Promises be damned, society is not going to shut down every social and critical public safety service to pay average Guvmint workers more than they are (ever were) worth. Plan accordingly, AFSCME.

 
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Mark K

Super Anarchist
47,621
1,868
Yes. The pensions will be under a lot of pressure. The unions will probably be given a choice, cuts in employment or cuts in pensions. The math has become too difficult. The money just isn't there.
For many states, the answer is to admit reality, declare bankruptcy, and shift pension math to the PBGC (Federal Pension Benefit Guarantee Corp).

It won't happen for a variety of reasons, of course, but just imagine an average public sector worker waking up to this, as many in the private sector have:

Q. How can I find out if my pension plan is underfunded?

 

A. Your plan administrator is required to give you an annual written notice regarding the funded status of the plan. That or perhaps read a damned newspaper. Your state is OBVIOUSLY bankrupt.

 

Q. When does PBGC terminate a pension plan?

 

A. PBGC can do so if, for example, a plan will be unable to pay benefits when due. Meaning PBGC should be knocking on your state's door, or certainly mine, within the next 2 minutes.

 

 

Q. What benefits does PBGC guarantee?

 

A. The pension benefit PBGC pays depends on (1) provisions of your plan, (2) legal limits, (3) the form of your benefit, (4) your age, (5) plan assets Oops!and (6) amounts (if any) PBGC recovers from employers for plan underfunding.

 

 

Q. Can I earn additional benefits after my plan’s termination date?

 

A. No. You cannot earn additional benefits after your plan terminates. Huh? Not even for School Superintendents????

 

 

Q. What is the maximum amount that PBGC can guarantee by law?

 

A. For 2009 and 2010, the maximum guaranteed amount is $4,500.00 per month ($54,000.00 per year) for workers who begin receiving payments from PBGC at age 65.The maximum guarantee is lower if you begin receiving payments from PBGC before age 65. Oh-oooh. That's gonna put a cramp on the retirement budget of one of our local veteran drivers ed teachers, currently slated to retire on twice that amount...

 

Guvmint pensions were originally designed on the premise of arguably below-market wages in exchange for arguably above-market pensions & other benefits. That balance got out of whack, is bankrupting us, and will end in some (ugly) fashion. Promises be damned, society is not going to shut down every social and critical public safety service to pay average Guvmint workers more than they are (ever were) worth. Plan accordingly, AFSCME.

from your link to PBGC, answer to the first question:

Q. What is the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC)?

 

A. PBGC is a federal agency created by the Employee Retirement Income Security Act of 1974 (ERISA) to protect pension benefits in private-sector traditional pension plans known as defined benefit plans.

\

You sure you're on the right tack here cscow?

 

whitehall

Anarchist
839
19
It won't happen for a variety of reasons, of course, but just imagine an average public sector worker waking up to this, as many in the private sector have:
You sure you're on the right tack here cscow?
Let's try this again, Mark.

It won't happen for a variety of reasons, of course, but just imagine... ;)

You are right, of course. From PBGC: "Plans offered by...federal, state or local governments usually are not insured". Unlike Obamacare health insurance, PBGC can and does deny pension insurance coverage for those with pre-existing bankruptcy conditions.

The assumption by public unions is taxes will just be raised and services cut indefinitely to pay for oversized pensions "earned" by political bribes (excuse me..."donations") rather than full length careers of tangible work. On that point, I contend they will eventually be proven wrong. As you note, the money is not there. Best case, they should count on the "oversized" portion being paid as IOU's. Very, very long term IOU's, I suspect.

 
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President Eisenhowler

Super Anarchist
9,356
0
Gee, it was either cut services to the disabled or (gasp!) raise the age at which state employees can retire with full pension to over 55!
I think the $720 million they spent on Lucas stadium for the Colts had something to do with it.

Funny how the State Employee Unions won't give an inch of their beloved benefits that private sector workers only dream about.

Boy I can see a Revolution coming and I would not want to be a public sector employee.
Karl Rove is a fucking genius, eh? Now we have members of basically the same class hating each other based on whether their employer is public or private sector. Divide and conquer, rules the day!

 

Mark K

Super Anarchist
47,621
1,868
It won't happen for a variety of reasons, of course, but just imagine an average public sector worker waking up to this, as many in the private sector have:
You sure you're on the right tack here cscow?
Let's try this again, Mark.

It won't happen for a variety of reasons, of course, but just imagine... ;)

You are right, of course. From PBGC: "Plans offered by...federal, state or local governments usually are not insured". Unlike Obamacare health insurance, PBGC can and does deny pension insurance coverage for those with pre-existing bankruptcy conditions.

The assumption by public unions is taxes will just be raised and services cut indefinitely to pay for oversized pensions "earned" by political bribes (excuse me..."donations") rather than full length careers of tangible work. On that point, I contend they will eventually be proven wrong. As you note, the money is not there. Best case, they should count on the "oversized" portion being paid as IOU's. Very, very long term IOU's, I suspect.
I do not see IOU's entering in, unless they are very temporary with fixed terms that can be persued in court. I see the only card the state can play a threat to cut the number of jobs. Bankruptsy would largely end the states ability to borrow money and the unions would see such a threat as this:

cleavon.jpg


 


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