The Stray Goat Julie B

[Pertinacious Tom]

I'm about to start restoring the stray Goat Island Skiff that followed me home. Her name is Julie B and she needs a new home, but first she needs some work.

Here's the story:

https://www.tropicalboating.com/2019/10/reviving-the-stray-goat

Any advice on the project will be appreciated!

 

[Max Rockatansky]

This looks like a basic plywood pirogue(ish)?

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

I guess. It's a design by Michael Storer. On Facebook, he's frequently advising people against bright ideas to make it stronger because they all make it heavier. Empty weight is supposed to be 125 lbs, IIRC. I haven't weighed this one but my brother and I picked it up and flipped it over with no trouble. Neither of us is in any danger of winning a Mr. Universe contest, so it doesn't weigh much.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Pic from the designer's page:

That looks fun!

 

[Diarmuid]

GIS has a very good reputation among small boat builders/sailors, and that one does not look terribly executed.

My only advice at this point: PAINT IT. You've lived in Florida long enuf to know what the sun does to clear coat finishes. Bright work is pretty and all, but the nicest thing you could do for that boat is to lay down some sunscreen pigment. By the time you realize the varnish is failing, you end up with ... well, that transom there.  

Will follow your progress with interest.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

My only advice at this point: PAINT IT. You've lived in Florida long enuf to know what the sun does to clear coat finishes.

If you mean the inside, I don't think I'll do that.

See the shade cloth next to the Toyota van? That's where this boat lives, with the bow several feet inside the shade cloth. The filtered sunlight barely hits the bow in winter mornings when the sun is in the southern sky and no sun hits the rest of the boat at all.

I like the look of the bright interior finish and also like the fact that I can see whether the wood is rotting. Can't see what's happening under paint.

Also, the goal here is to sell the boat to raise money for the Sailing Center and I think it will bring more money this way.

 

[Diarmuid]

Fair enuf. Next owner's problem, I guess. There's some pleasure in scraping and varnishing every six months.

 

[andykane]

I built a boat to his Beth design, which is a similar philosophy of good foils and light, stiff, modern ply construction. It sails like a hot damn and the GIS should be no different. Definitely no basic pirogue - it's got excellent pedigree.

 

[Blue Crab]

Fair enuf. Next owner's problem, I guess. There's some pleasure in scraping and varnishing every six months.

It comes at the end.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

I've been focused on a couple of powerboat projects but have made a bit of progress on the GIS.

I spent a lot of time wondering how I would get the intact, but mostly detached, runner off the bottom of the hull without tearing a hole in the bottom.

The answer turned out to be to cut the fillets with the Fein Multimaster and then gently pry it up. No damage.

This success led me to focus on the next question, what to use to replace the broken runner?

It's a hard question for two reasons: I don't know what I'd want to shop for and even if I did, I have only a Home Depot and a local lumber yard that has about the same stuff as Home Depot. What would be a good wood and where would I get it?

I asked the head of the local sailing center and he told me he had some pieces of a really nice exotic flavor of mahogany that someone had been using as boat lift bunks. Yes, really.

I went alone to get one and it turns out that a 10' 5" piece of mahogany that's 12" wide and 2.5" deep is a very heavy thing. I nearly dropped it trying to get it on top of my van.

Got it home and tried to cut off a usable slice and it made the table saw smoke and stopped the blade. We wound up sending it over the table saw in 4 passes of about a half inch depth each. A couple more passes to take an inch off the resulting strip, then some chewing with a power planer and now I have a piece that's darn close to an exact copy of the intact one.

Next up: some precision grinder work to prepare the bottom of the hull to attach the runners.

 

[Diamond Jim]

When you give the interior its needed refinishing, I’d borrow a router with a round over bit and make the rail more butt-friendly.  It’ll hold finish better without the sharp corners.

 

[KC375]

I've been focused on a couple of powerboat projects but have made a bit of progress on the GIS.

I spent a lot of time wondering how I would get the intact, but mostly detached, runner off the bottom of the hull without tearing a hole in the bottom.

The answer turned out to be to cut the fillets with the Fein Multimaster and then gently pry it up. No damage.

This success led me to focus on the next question, what to use to replace the broken runner?

It's a hard question for two reasons: I don't know what I'd want to shop for and even if I did, I have only a Home Depot and a local lumber yard that has about the same stuff as Home Depot. What would be a good wood and where would I get it?

I asked the head of the local sailing center and he told me he had some pieces of a really nice exotic flavor of mahogany that someone had been using as boat lift bunks. Yes, really.

I went alone to get one and it turns out that a 10' 5" piece of mahogany that's 12" wide and 2.5" deep is a very heavy thing. I nearly dropped it trying to get it on top of my van.

Got it home and tried to cut off a usable slice and it made the table saw smoke and stopped the blade. We wound up sending it over the table saw in 4 passes of about a half inch depth each. A couple more passes to take an inch off the resulting strip, then some chewing with a power planer and now I have a piece that's darn close to an exact copy of the intact one.

Next up: some precision grinder work to prepare the bottom of the hull to attach the runners.

I look forward to more pictures of progress.

Sounds like your Mahogany (Swietenia) may not actually be one of the many tropical woods sold as “mahogany”...given you found it heavy and hard to work it might be Ipe 69 lbs/ft3, hard Janka3,510   (very rot resistant and very hard so could be good choice for the use).

If it were “genuine” mahogany say Swietenia mahogani or Swietenia macrophyll it would be relatively light 37lbs/ft3  and easy to work but not hard janka 900-930

 

[Rasputin22]

That wood has to be something like red locust. One of the worst for smoking a saw blade or router bit. Did the smoke smell like a burning outhouse? If you put the piece of wood in water does it sink? That tells a lot. Whatever don't breath any dust from that jungle mystery wood!

 

[Diarmuid]

Nah -- almost certainly Khaya, or African mahogany. The giveaway is the size of the board: slabbed AM is frequently very wide, very long, and available in thicknesses to 12/4. I built a queen-sized bed out of two sticks of it: one 27" wide by 12' long by 2" thick. 

A board the size of Tom's will be heavy even if  relatively low-density AM, just because it's a damned big plank. Here are two sticks of 4/4 (nominal, nominally quartersawn) khaya on a 60" wide flatbed, wetted to show color & grain:



They are 14' long and the wider is about 22" across, inch and an eighth rough thickness. The reason they burn and bind on saw blades is due to pretty severe internal stresses, which are released during machining. The ribbon figure associated with AM is a product of reversing grain, where the tree twists one direction for a year or two, then twists the other, and so on. Then the very large tree is slabbed thru and dried, creating a board in static equilibrium but absolutely loaded with internal tension. The boards will even grab a chopsaw blade. Splitters or riving knives are an absolute must on a tablesaw if you want to live. Tom hit on another clever way to cope with the issue: take multiple shallow cuts, each pass widening the kerf as required & minimizing binding and burning. I do a lot of work in African mahogany, and it has some quirks for sure! You ain't buying New World (true) mahogany in those sizes, not for under $500 a stick.

Personally, I'd make the runners from black HDPE. Runners exist to take a beating. HDPE takes a beating, comes back for more.

 

[KC375]

Nah -- almost certainly Khaya, or African mahogany. The giveaway is the size of the board: slabbed AM is frequently very wide, very long, and available in thicknesses to 12/4. I built a queen-sized bed out of two sticks of it: one 27" wide by 12' long by 2" thick. 

A board the size of Tom's will be heavy even if  relatively low-density AM, just because it's a damned big plank. Here are two sticks of 4/4 (nominal, nominally quartersawn) khaya on a 60" wide flatbed, wetted to show color & grain:

View attachment 335022

They are 14' long and the wider is about 22" across, inch and an eighth rough thickness. The reason they burn and bind on saw blades is due to pretty severe internal stresses, which are released during machining. The ribbon figure associated with AM is a product of reversing grain, where the tree twists one direction for a year or two, then twists the other, and so on. Then the very large tree is slabbed thru and dried, creating a board in static equilibrium but absolutely loaded with internal tension. The boards will even grab a chopsaw blade. Splitters or riving knives are an absolute must on a tablesaw if you want to live. Tom hit on another clever way to cope with the issue: take multiple shallow cuts, each pass widening the kerf as required & minimizing binding and burning. I do a lot of work in African mahogany, and it has some quirks for sure! You ain't buying New World (true) mahogany in those sizes, not for under $500 a stick.

Personally, I'd make the runners from black HDPE. Runners exist to take a beating. HDPE takes a beating, comes back for more.

If Tom's plank is mahogany is should weigh around 80 lbs, if it is Ipe or the like it should weigh around 150 lbs.

If it is "african mahogany" ( Khaya spp. (Khaya anthotheca, K. grandifoliola, K. ivorensis, K. senegalensis) then it would be weigh in around 90 lbs, be less workable and less rot/insect resistant than mahogany (but still good ) and way more workable than Ipe. I agree with Diarmuid the chances of finding a genuine mahogany plank 12" by 10' are not high.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

African mahogany comes in big boards but it's not incredibly heavy.  

Iroko and Jatoba are both big and heavy, rot resistant, and the right piece of either could look like mahogany. 

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

That wood has to be something like red locust. One of the worst for smoking a saw blade or router bit. Did the smoke smell like a burning outhouse? If you put the piece of wood in water does it sink? That tells a lot. Whatever don't breath any dust from that jungle mystery wood!

It smelled like normal burning wood. I haven't dunked it but wouldn't be at all surprised if it sinks. I'm already about done breathing the dust from it so won't breathe much more.

Tom hit on another clever way to cope with the issue: take multiple shallow cuts, each pass widening the kerf as required & minimizing binding and burning. I do a lot of work in African mahogany, and it has some quirks for sure! You ain't buying New World (true) mahogany in those sizes, not for under $500 a stick.

Personally, I'd make the runners from black HDPE. Runners exist to take a beating. HDPE takes a beating, comes back for more.

My less clever idea was to break out the chainsaw. Sounds like that may have been a worse plan than I thought.

I had not considered plastic runners but it's a pretty good idea. I was thinking of a strip of fiberglass epoxied onto the bottoms for a bit more abrasion resistance.

I broke out the grinder today and took off the old glue and some surrounding paint on one side. I'll post some pictures before long.

I'll be interested to see if you all can identify the mystery boat lift bunk wood. It's not red like mahogany I have seen. It's brown with maybe just a hint of green in it but nothing you'd call red. Fine grain. I'll post some close-ups of it when I get a round tuit. Whatever it might be, it's waaay to nice for a boat lift bunk.

 

[Rasputin22]

It smelled like normal burning wood. I haven't dunked it but wouldn't be at all surprised if it sinks. I'm already about done breathing the dust from it so won't breathe much more.

My less clever idea was to break out the chainsaw. Sounds like that may have been a worse plan than I thought.

I had not considered plastic runners but it's a pretty good idea. I was thinking of a strip of fiberglass epoxied onto the bottoms for a bit more abrasion resistance.

I broke out the grinder today and took off the old glue and some surrounding paint on one side. I'll post some pictures before long.

I'll be interested to see if you all can identify the mystery boat lift bunk wood. It's not red like mahogany I have seen. It's brown with maybe just a hint of green in it but nothing you'd call red. Fine grain. I'll post some close-ups of it when I get a round tuit. Whatever it might be, it's waaay to nice for a boat lift bunk.

Redheart or more likely Greenheart from Guiana. The Greenheart slowly looses its green color and turns brown but a fresh cut will show the green you mention. About as tough and durable as you will every come across. Highly prized as keel stock for the Island Schooners and Sloops. I was gifted a nice piece of it I used as a grounding shoe on a 23' Island Sloop I built on St John. First time I spent a full day working with it on some door millwork I was covered with the dust from thickness planer and later sanding and it had the fresh cut greenish color to it. I jumped in the shower when I got home and was rinsing my face and head trying first to get the nasty dust caked in the corners of my eyes and when I had them rinsed well enough to see I glanced down at my feet and thought I was seening the shower scene from that Hitchcock movie where the slasher goes after Janet Leigh with the blood swirling down the drain at the Bates Hotel. I could have sworn it was blood and I checked my whole body expecting to find a bleeding wound but the Greenheart dust turns a bright Red when fresh water hits it. Same thing when you mix it with epoxy to try and fill the checks and seams that it is prone to after seasoning. 

    Red Locust is much the same and all of them have very toxic dust, the bugs an even marine critters can't touch it. I've had shop helpers that were particularly sensitive to the dust especially at their beltline, sleeve line or neckline where the shirt and pants when damp with sweat catch the dust and the dampness releases the toxins or whatever. I had a friend from St Thomas who had commissioned a recreation of a revenue schooner to be built on the beach in the old manner on Nevis. The ancient Nevisian boatbuilder told the guy to first get back on his boat and sail to Guiana and buy the biggest log of Greenheart he could find and bring it back to his little beach boatshed. The guy asked how he was supposed to ship the sail Greenheart telephone pole size log and the old timer told him he would find it on the bank of the river mouth from where it had been chopped from the jungle. He said that the loggers had to lash a couple of extra log of a lighter less dense wood to the Greenheart bole as it would sink if freshly cut and put into fresh water. He said that after sitting in the sun on the riverbank it would now float when put into the brackish water at the rivermouth and a little better when he towed it out in the saltwater on the long reach back up to Nevis! My friend said that was the longest slowest trip he ever took in his boat but he finally successfully got his keel to the builder who by then had made up most of the frames to have them ready to fit to the new keel.

the last schooner built in Nevis, the magnificent Alexander Hamilton. 

https://www.caribbeancompass.com/workboats.html

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

I could have sworn it was blood and I checked my whole body expecting to find a bleeding wound but the Greenheart dust turns a bright Red when fresh water hits it.

Now that you mention it, the pile left behind by the power planer got rained on and did look kinda red when it was wet.

Personally, I'd make the runners from black HDPE. Runners exist to take a beating. HDPE takes a beating, comes back for more.

Thinking more about this, it might not be such a great idea. The GIS is a light boat with a design weight of 128 lbs. I've seen several discussions of the runners stiffening up the bottom. Plastic isn't stiff. Anyway, now that I've got a piece of greenheart or whatever it is to match the runner that came with the boat, the easy choice is to install it.