Trash Island

[2slow]

Trash layer then? It isn't really much of a secret that the worlds oceans are getting more and more polluted. Anyones whos ever gone surfing or even left their boat in the water for a few days have seen the layer of scum that exists. Personally I would never want to be a diver doing bottoms in most marinas and yacht clubs. And have you ever seen a beach before it is combed or groomed every morning? Might make you think twice before you go jump in.

I don't mind the plastic debris too much, but the open heads are just nerchy.

I once went swimming off the bow at my old dock (against better advice), a few hundred feet downstream from the Chelsea Piers Marina, which didn't offer a pump-out at the time. By the next day I contracted the most bizarre infection, everytime I hawked a loogie it was nearly the color of day-glow green slime. That was just one swim ... do these marina divers build up an immunity after a few months of swimming in dilute sewage?

They charge about $100 for a 30-foot boat, waterline to keel, I guess they're not starving, but it's a tough way to make a living.

I only made the mistake of swimming in a crowded anchorage in the BVI's once. That is fucking disgusting. Some of the nastiest water I have ever seen is the AM at The Bight, Norman Island.

 

[JackMontana]

Assuming that 99.99% of "those who sail" don't litter, how should we be part of the solution?

Continuing to be excellent stewards of the ocean is the most important. Past that, increasing awareness of the problem and advocating for solutions rather than undercutting the issue with semantic arguments about whether or not it's an island since you can't walk on it would be an excellent tack. Yes, the media's portrayal of everything is overdramatized. In other news, water is wet, espo's a dick, and EB is a poor sportsman. That's not a reason to dismiss the actual problem, and there is a significant problem.

Fine.  In the mean time, can you please ask your buddies to stop writing headlines like

TOXIC: Garbage Island

and

VBS travels to a spot in the Pacific where trash buildup has formed a massive floating island.

That would help.

Thanks,

"my buddies" ? :huh:

The media get it wrong. Often. This should surprise precisely no one. In this case the headlines characterize the issue incorrectly. The headline would more appropriately read:

TOXIC: Garbage Soup

and

VBS travels to a spot in the Pacific where trash buildup has formed a massive plastic/chemical soup.

I don't see how that makes a substantive difference. Furthermore, my argument is that the media's portrayal of the issue isn't the point, and I feel that a frank discussion of this issue among an interested community such as sailors is too often tripped up on this and other semantic issues. This is precisely what happened when the Ed put this story on the front page. Instead of talking about the real ecological tragedy that is taking place, the conversation revolved around whether or not the picture that accompanied the information was a true reflection of the problem, whether or not is should be called an island, and whether the newspapers should alter their headlines. Folks dropped in to call B.S. on the picture, or the headline, were very pleased with themselves and promptly moved on. That bad headlines invite this type of behavior is a problem, I'll agree with you on that. That this community of seemingly informed and interested individuals can't move beyond that and talk about the real issue is disheartening. However, I suspect that the real issue is that people are looking for a way to dismiss the issue by discrediting the messenger.

J

 

[creedence623]

I always liked George Carlin's take on the issue:

We’re so self-important. So self-important. Everybody’s going to save something now. “Save the trees, save the bees, save the whales, save those snails.” And the greatest arrogance of all: save the planet. What? Are these fucking people kidding me? Save the planet, we don’t even know how to take care of ourselves yet. We haven’t learned how to care for one another, we’re gonna save the fucking planet?

I’m getting tired of that shit. Tired of that shit. I’m tired of fucking Earth Day, I’m tired of these self-righteous environmentalists, these white, bourgeois liberals who think the only thing wrong with this country is there aren’t enough bicycle paths. People trying to make the world save for their Volvos. Besides, environmentalists don’t give a shit about the planet. They don’t care about the planet. Not in the abstract they don’t. Not in the abstract they don’t. You know what they’re interested in? A clean place to live. Their own habitat. They’re worried that some day in the future, they might be personally inconvenienced. Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesn’t impress me.

Besides, there is nothing wrong with the planet. Nothing wrong with the planet. The planet is fine. The PEOPLE are fucked. Difference. Difference. The planet is fine. Compared to the people, the planet is doing great. Been here four and a half billion years. Did you ever think about the arithmetic? The planet has been here four and a half billion years. We’ve been here, what, a hundred thousand? Maybe two hundred thousand? And we’ve only been engaged in heavy industry for a little over two hundred years. Two hundred years versus four and a half billion. And we have the CONCEIT to think that somehow we’re a threat? That somehow we’re gonna put in jeopardy this beautiful little blue-green ball that’s just a-floatin’ around the sun?

The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through all kinds of things worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles…hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worlwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages…And we think some plastic bags, and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet…the planet…the planet isn’t going anywhere. WE ARE!

We’re going away. Pack your shit, folks. We’re going away. And we won’t leave much of a trace, either. Thank God for that. Maybe a little styrofoam. Maybe. A little styrofoam. The planet’ll be here and we’ll be long gone. Just another failed mutation. Just another closed-end biological mistake. An evolutionary cul-de-sac. The planet’ll shake us off like a bad case of fleas. A surface nuisance.

You wanna know how the planet’s doing? Ask those people at Pompeii, who are frozen into position from volcanic ash, how the planet’s doing. You wanna know if the planet’s all right, ask those people in Mexico City or Armenia or a hundred other places buried under thousands of tons of earthquake rubble, if they feel like a threat to the planet this week. Or how about those people in Kilowaia, Hawaii, who built their homes right next to an active volcano, and then wonder why they have lava in the living room.

The planet will be here for a long, long, LONG time after we’re gone, and it will heal itself, it will cleanse itself, ’cause that’s what it does. It’s a self-correcting system. The air and the water will recover, the earth will be renewed, and if it’s true that plastic is not degradable, well, the planet will simply incorporate plastic into a new pardigm: the earth plus plastic. The earth doesn’t share our prejudice towards plastic. Plastic came out of the earth. The earth probably sees plastic as just another one of its children. Could be the only reason the earth allowed us to be spawned from it in the first place. It wanted plastic for itself. Didn’t know how to make it. Needed us. Could be the answer to our age-old egocentric philosophical question, “Why are we here?” Plastic…asshole.

So, the plastic is here, our job is done, we can be phased out now. And I think that’s begun. Don’t you think that’s already started? I think, to be fair, the planet sees us as a mild threat. Something to be dealt with. And the planet can defend itself in an organized, collective way, the way a beehive or an ant colony can. A collective defense mechanism. The planet will think of something. What would you do if you were the planet? How would you defend yourself against this troublesome, pesky species? Let’s see… Viruses. Viruses might be good. They seem vulnerable to viruses. And, uh…viruses are tricky, always mutating and forming new strains whenever a vaccine is developed. Perhaps, this first virus could be one that compromises the immune system of these creatures. Perhaps a human immunodeficiency virus, making them vulnerable to all sorts of other diseases and infections that might come along. And maybe it could be spread sexually, making them a little reluctant to engage in the act of reproduction.

Well, that’s a poetic note. And it’s a start. And I can dream, can’t I? See I don’t worry about the little things: bees, trees, whales, snails. I think we’re part of a greater wisdom than we will ever understand. A higher order. Call it what you want. Know what I call it? The Big Electron. The Big Electron…whoooa. Whoooa. Whoooa. It doesn’t punish, it doesn’t reward, it doesn’t judge at all. It just is. And so are we. For a little while.

 

[Silverbullet]

That was 11 minutes I will never get back. It would help if I didn't want to punch the glasses off of the arrogant little fuck in the video.

A little advice junior journalist...When you make yourself part (if not all) of the story, you detract from the real story. On the plus side, as long as you have a hot blonde chick in the story, it will keep viewers somewhat interested.

 

[InNeedOfSomeRestraint]

Assuming that 99.99% of "those who sail" don't litter, how should we be part of the solution?

Continuing to be excellent stewards of the ocean is the most important. Past that, increasing awareness of the problem and advocating for solutions rather than undercutting the issue with semantic arguments about whether or not it's an island since you can't walk on it would be an excellent tack. Yes, the media's portrayal of everything is overdramatized. In other news, water is wet, espo's a dick, and EB is a poor sportsman. That's not a reason to dismiss the actual problem, and there is a significant problem.

J

How 'bout dis. Next time there's a "support the movement to clean up the Pacific gyre" rally in my area I'll attend. Deal? Good. Now can we please get back to trashing Clean already. All this AC-Love for him is making my eyes burn.

 

[valis]

Furthermore, my argument is that the media's portrayal of the issue isn't the point, and I feel that a frank discussion of this issue among an interested community such as sailors is too often tripped up on this and other semantic issues.

And my point is that it is impossible to have a frank discussion when the major proponents insist on "sensationalizing" (lying) about the issue.  That shit is going to backfire on them, and the problem would be better served if they would just tell the truth.  The truth is bad enough -- I've sailed through the gyre area three times now, and one time even attempted to collect some actual data.  Look, the Gyre is a symptom, and the problem is elsewhere.  Even the symptoms are worse elsewhere, the Gyre is just the crisis du jour.

Tell the truth.  Provide meaningful data.  That's all I'm asking for.

 

[Regatta Dog]

Furthermore, my argument is that the media's portrayal of the issue isn't the point, and I feel that a frank discussion of this issue among an interested community such as sailors is too often tripped up on this and other semantic issues.

And my point is that it is impossible to have a frank discussion when the major proponents insist on "sensationalizing" (lying) about the issue. That shit is going to backfire on them, and the problem would be better served if they would just tell the truth. The truth is bad enough -- I've sailed through the gyre area three times now, and one time even attempted to collect some actual data. Look, the Gyre is a symptom, and the problem is elsewhere. Even the symptoms are worse elsewhere, the Gyre is just the crisis du jour.

Tell the truth. Provide meaningful data. That's all I'm asking for.

+ 1

The truth is you need to go to an awareness boot camp. Data is meaningless. You are better than other humans if you are more aware. You are much better than other humans if you spread that awareness.

The first 10 seconds of video shows some guy lounging on sail bags, and at 0:22 shows a spinnaker flying 2' off the mast head. The next 5 minutes shows a guy who had never been on a boat before, had read about sailing and had to take fucking swimming lessons. What's with this guy? As a bowman, I'd rather fuck with sharks than lions.

Take it to GA/PA. I'm all for stopping the flow of plastics into the rivers and oceans of the world, but the "crisis" message should be focused on NASCAR fans, third world countries, and the packaging industry.

Maybe someone should contact Captain Paul Watson and let him know about this mountain of plastic. The Sea Shepherds could take their flotilla up there and save the fucking planet. Discovery Channel could show the fat fuck tossing stink bombs at people on the beach in Malibu who casually walk to their cars in the parking lot and leave a plastic bottle on the beach.

Tedious, this.

 

[jackdale]

While on a Vic-Maui return in 2000, we decided to power through the Pacific High. At one point I was convinced that someone was ahead of us throwing 1 foot square pieces of white plastic into the water. I saw several oil bottles and a very nice Japanese glass fishing float. What we did not see was the piece of fishing net about 3 feet by 4 feet that wrapped itself around around the prop shaft, destroying our transmission.

So there we were in the middle of the high with no wind and no means of propulsion. :angry:

Obviously we made it back.

Do I believe in "trash island"? Been there, done that.

Here is the latest story:

Oceanographers have found that a vast floating island of rubbish in the Pacific has doubled over a decade and is now twice as large as Texas.
The giant waste collection, known as the "Great Pacific Garbage Patch," lies between California and Hawaii and has been growing gradually for 60 years.

It contains everything from plastic bags to shampoo bottles, flip-flops, children's toys, tires, drink cans, Frisbees and plastic swimming pools.

Older debris has slowly broken down under the sun's rays into small particles which settle and are suspended just below the ocean surface.

Read more: http://www.calgaryhe...l#ixzz0hbiQf1qw

I am scheduled to do another return this year.

 

[Nomenclature]

Assuming that 99.99% of "those who sail" don't litter, how should we be part of the solution?

I agree that none of us intentionally dispose of plastics irresponsibly.

But that does not ensure that some portion of our refuse does not find its way

to the sea. The dumpsters in the marina are often over filled, with trash spilling

over the top. The trash truck leaves with stuff flying out of it.

I believe the place for us to attack the problem is at the consumer level.

It seems that every boat I sail on has dozens of those tiny plastic water

bottles littering the cockpit by the end of a race. It is time to put a stop

to this culture of purchsing everything in miniscule individually wrapped

portions. In most cases you are paying ten times as much for the packaging.

than you are for the product. It is not that difficult to buy water in one or

three gallon containers and distribute it in reusable cups or bottles.

I often go around my marina picking trash out of the water, the most

ubiquitous form of trash is those rediculous single serving chip bags

that hold about five chips each. Why not just pass around a large bag

of chips instead.

 

[floating dutchman]

Assuming that 99.99% of "those who sail" don't litter, how should we be part of the solution?

I agree that none of us intentionally dispose of plastics irresponsibly.

But that does not ensure that some portion of our refuse does not find its way

to the sea. The dumpsters in the marina are often over filled, with trash spilling

over the top. The trash truck leaves with stuff flying out of it.

I believe the place for us to attack the problem is at the consumer level.

It seems that every boat I sail on has dozens of those tiny plastic water

bottles littering the cockpit by the end of a race. It is time to put a stop

to this culture of purchsing everything in miniscule individually wrapped

portions. In most cases you are paying ten times as much for the packaging.

than you are for the product. It is not that difficult to buy water in one or

three gallon containers and distribute it in reusable cups or bottles.

I often go around my marina picking trash out of the water, the most

ubiquitous form of trash is those rediculous single serving chip bags

that hold about five chips each. Why not just pass around a large bag

of chips instead.

I'm guilty of most of what you just said

"Those who sail" need to be part of the solution just like everybody else.

Even if we only make very small difference it's a start of an attitude that just might catch on to others.

edit: If this is happening on the surface and not all plastic floats, What is happening on the see floor in these places?

 

[Somebody Else]

I always liked George Carlin's take on the issue:

That pretty much sums up my take on the matter.

Save the planet?

Save your own butt is more like it.

We may drive ourselves to extinction, maybe in as short a time as a generation or two, but the planet will still be here.

 

[Snaggletooth]

I'm in my "hate on people who needlessly start new threads" mood. Why don't you do a fuckin search and bump the other thread on this topic. One thread about the nonexistant trash island is enough.

hates a stroung word for those young, hate usualy came latter in life.