Ukraine and Only Ukraine. If it isn't about Ukraine then fuck off

[badlatitude]

Not really costly to Putin as the gas was pretty much on/off already, and NSII wasn't even live. So, message that they are willing to hit NATO where it hurts does seem reasonable. No need to announce, let NATO scramble assets to figure it out.

It will definitely be a costly repair, the interior of the pipeline has been exposed to salt water and will have to be replaced. I can't tell how much pipeline, that hasn't been released.

 

[Raz'r]

It will definitely be a costly repair, the interior of the pipeline has been exposed to salt water and will have to be replaced. I can't tell how much pipeline, that hasn't been released.

Why repair it? It's not like Germany will trust Russia for about a generation or so.

 

[Steam Flyer]

Not a good precedent. We didn't try to make Japan into the 51st state... well, it would have been the 49th state back then in 1945... but the point is that we did not use nuclear weapons in a war of conquest.

Alaska & Hawaii did not get statehood until '59.

Yes, that is very true. This is why I added the 2nd part "well, it would have been the 49th state back then in 1945... but the point is that we did not use nuclear weapons in a war of conquest."

 

[badlatitude]

Why repair it? It's not like Germany will trust Russia for about a generation or so.

It's Germany's call of course, all they need is a replacement.

 

[Steam Flyer]

I totally agree with your statement, now please explain it to Putin?
.

I would be glad to, if I could.

Hopefully the State Dept has people that can.

 

[Deleted member 149385]

I would be glad to, if I could.

Hopefully the State Dept has people that can.

Don’t count on it. Not with this Administration.

 

[Mark_K]

Not really costly to Putin as the gas was pretty much on/off already, and NSII wasn't even live. So, message that they are willing to hit NATO where it hurts does seem reasonable. No need to announce, let NATO scramble assets to figure it out.

But why would Russia feel a need to prove they can shut down their own gas from flowing to the EU?

 

[Deleted member 149385]

But why would Russia feel a need to prove they can shut down their own gas from flowing to the EU?

They don’t. Which is why none of this makes any sense.

 

[Steam Flyer]

Don’t count on it. Not with this Administration.

This Administration is the one that is rebuilding the State Dept after the prior one either drove out or fired all the professionals.

Same thing with HEW.

For that matter, I expect it's the same to a smaller extent across the board in the Federal bureaucracy. First of all, Republicans have always hated the dadgum gubbermint just because it's there and 2ndly Trump -really- hated the State Dept because they had a front-row seat to his lap dancing for Putin.

 

[mikewof]

Mike, I don’t see any scenario where that happens.

I don't either. But a destabilization to the NPT followed by a new nuclear arms race? The writing for that is on the wall.

 

[billy backstay]

contractual obligations have been raised as a possibility.

Please explain? Seems the only easy money he has is from selling petroleum products, why sabotage a Golden Goose??
.

 

[mikewof]

Miguel, the NPT is irrelevant at this point. Just like our agreement to keep the Ukraines sovereignty. Not enforced by Obama et Al. Sorry we own this too.

You are wrong on this. The NPT is the most successful and widely signed treaty in Earth's history.

As of this moment, every signatory to the NPT is compliant including Ukraine, USA, and Russia, every signatory except Britain.

To paraphrase Hans Blix, wars come and go, but nuclear disarmament requires constant vigilance.

 

[Ishmael]

Please explain? Seems the only easy money he has is from selling petroleum products, why sabotage a Golden Goose??
.

It suits Putin's methodology of putting a coat of legality on top of whatever the bullshit de jour is. If they can't deliver the gas because the pipeline is broken, then they don't get fined for non-performance of a legal contract.

 

[Virgulino Ferreira]

So maybe Great Britain should have Rowan Atkinson (Mr Bean) as Prime Minister? He would fit right in with Zelensky and Putin!

Indeed.

 

[Raz'r]

Please explain? Seems the only easy money he has is from selling petroleum products, why sabotage a Golden Goose??
.

it's all speculation at the moment, this from Forbes:

One may be tempted to ask why would the Russians bother with sabotage and denial? After all, hostility toward Ukraine and Europe is neither novel nor secret. The shutoff of gas from sabotage does not fundamentally change Russia’s stated aims or enacted strategy. The answer lies in the strength of Western financial institutions, Russia’s lack of leverage or soft power, and the devastating impacts sanctions are having against Russia. If Nord Stream is shut down suddenly through “force majeure,” a sudden uncontrollable stop that is the fault of neither party, then Russia can void its obligations toward European stakeholders without legally breaking contracts, thus dodging the many penalties in doing so.

The other great reason Putin is expending so much effort in pursuit of such a transparent strategy lies in his domestic vulnerability. By ending all possible routes for gas delivery resumption with the West and making rapprochement more difficult, Russian oligarchs who have not yet fallen out of a window, but may still be wavering in their dedication to Putin, have no choice to acquiesce to his leadership.

 

[Deleted member 149385]

You are wrong on this. The NPT is the most successful and widely signed treaty in Earth's history.

As of this moment, every signatory to the NPT is compliant including Ukraine, USA, and Russia, every signatory except Britain.

To paraphrase Hans Blix, wars come and go, but nuclear disarmament requires constant vigilance.

Sorry it is irrelevant with one of the signatories threatening use. It becomes a survival scenario pretty quickly. As a citizen of the Commonwealth, I very much support the UK.

 

[billy backstay]

It suits Putin's methodology of putting a coat of legality on top of whatever the bullshit de jour is. If they can't deliver the gas because the pipeline is broken, then they don't get fined for non-performance of a legal contract.

So, he is using a "force majeure" clause to get out of selling the one thing that is financing his war machine? And doing it at great costs to repair underwater pipes, whenever he wants to resume selling gas in the future? WTF am I missing with this picture?
.

 

[Deleted member 149385]

So, he is using a "force majeure" clause to get out of selling the one thing that is financing his war machine? And doing it at great costs to repair underwater pipes, whenever he wants to resume selling gas in the future? WTF am I missing with this picture?
.

Absolutely nothing. Let’s hope our Basement Dummy had nothing to do with it.

 

[Deleted member 149385]

Force Majeure is irrelevant now.

 

[Virgulino Ferreira]