Ukraine

[enigmatically2]

I follow the German discussion ..the huge frustration of Germans over thier failing economy , pipe line destruction , bleak future and failure to use diplomacy to solve European issues

1) Failing economy. It is true that all the western economies are likely to suffer and there will be some recessions. A combination of governments having to make savings after Covid, the war in Ukraine and Brexit make that inevitable. But the worst predictions are nowhere near what Russia is already suffering. Recessions are not unique. We will cope
2) Pipeline destruction has caused temporary dislocation. But European fuel reserves are higher than last year and the price of oil has dropped back. Plus if it helps European wean itself off fossil fuels from corrupt, cruel dictatorships then in the long term it will be good
3) Bleak future? Come on sluggo, you live in the west don't you. You know that the bleakest future here is eden compared to much of Russia. People will complain but if you count on wholesale revolution you really are barking up the wrong tree
4) Failure to use diplomacy. The failure to use diplomacy lays firmly at Putin's door. In Clausewitz's words: war may indeed be the continuation of policy by other means. But sending tanks across your neighbours border and bombing his cities sure as fcuk isn't diplomacy

 

[enigmatically2]

@motorbike you talked about history. Here is a small reminder of history. In 1945 when Nazi forces were being defeated, Hitler ordered the acceleration of the holocaust- taking resources away from fighting the war. Now we have Lavrov who even as Russia is being defeated is worrying about gender neutral toilets. (Hint, in the west we all have toilets in our houses, shared by all genders, so really nothing new. Maybe one day you will get a plumbed in indoor toilet and you will understand)

 

[Davedave]

In Russia few people outside the largest cities have WC at all so this is really just the elites problem.

 

[Keith]

 

[Keith]

 

[Keith]

 

[enigmatically2]

Putin repeats claims that Poland wants to capture part of West Ukraine. And that Russia will be the only guarantor of Ukrainian integrity. Riiiiight

This is the same Poland generously taking in Ukrainian refugees and supply arms and lots else to Ukraine.

Admittedly Russia is also supplying arms to Ukraine, but they generally aren't in very good condition

 

[Alan H]

I gotta say.. "Poland wants to take over west Ukraine" is 100% bullshit, it's obviously Putin's attempt to sow discord among Ukraine's allies and anybody who repeats it more than once, to pooh-pooh it, is only furthering Vlad P. aims. The Poles have welcomed displaced Ukrainians by the millions. Thousand of Polish homes are housing Ukrainian refugees. There are five Polish researchers in my building, every one of them foams at the mouth about Putin and hates the war and is utterly behind Ukraine in this.

The very idea that Poland wants to take over western Ukraine is preposterous bullshit, and anybody who pushes the idea is only doing Putin's work.

 

[enigmatically2]

Re=stocking begins in earnest.
UK has announced a contract for assembling several thousand more NLAWs in NI - coincidentally about 1 for each tank Russia has left if you include those RU has in storage,
extending training of Ukr soldiers, and

US has given DoD permission to acquire

864,000 155mm rounds
12,050 #Excalibur rounds
12,000 #JAGM missiles
700 #HIMARS launchers
700 #ATACMS missiles
106,000 #GMLRS rounds

So @motorbike if you want to sweep NATO easily aside whilst we have no weapons left (apart from all the ones we do have) you'd better do it quickly. Oh, just remembered you are too busy retreating

 

[Priscilla]

pretty much every missile will approach from the rear

I would have thought missiles were generally too small and fast to reliably hit.

 

[enigmatically2]

Interesting statement from Putin:
Russian President Putin stated of the 300,000 mobilized in Russia, 150,000 remain present in the combat zone in Ukraine. He added that talking about additional mobilization does not make sense as "there is no such need today.

Debate amongst yourselves what happened to the other 150,000. Keep trolling @motorbike, he will need more fodder very soon

 

[LeoV]

And Russia is such a happy place Putin ordered the police, including riot police to expand. Up to 930.000 man.

 

[Sailbydate]

And Russia is such a happy place Putin ordered the police, including riot police to expand. Up to 930.000 man.

Maybe he is feeling a tad vulnerable?

 

[EYESAILOR]

The question becomes ever more incomprehensible: Why do so many Russians accept to be Putin's cannon fodder, sacrificing their lives for his authoritarianism & kleptocracy? This makes no sense.
And how come so many Russians are capable of murder, rape and other heinous crimes? What kind of society is Russia? What does it mean to be Russian?

I think my position on the war in Ukraine is clear......BUT.......I do not and will not let Putin and his foreign policy color my opinion on Russians and Russia.

I count Russians as some of the nicest people I have met and one day, after this is all over, I would like to go on vacation to Russia.

I dont think Russians are any more capable of murder, rape and heinous crimes than any other people .

It is easy to forget that in the USA and most of Europe we elect our politicians and we have a free press. If we elect a wrong 'un, we can throw them out. We get to hear both sides of the debate. Every time I hear some heinous views expressed by an extreme faction in the USA, my first reaction is "Ugh!", but my second reaction is "Ya know Im lucky to live in a country where people can say things that I strongly disagree with".

If you are Russian, you had no say in who your leader was. It is unfair to blame the everyday Russians for Putin's rise to power. The transition from a Communist dictatorship established by Stalin through Perestroika to a Criminal state run by an organized crime boss is one of the great tragedies of the final years of the 20th century. Nobody is paying a higher price for this than the Russians.

At least the Ukrainians have the option of fighting for their freedom.

 

[MR.CLEAN]

I dont think Russians are any more capable of murder, rape and heinous crimes than any other people .

Read more history.

 

[slug zitski]

I think my position on the war in Ukraine is clear......BUT.......I do not and will not let Putin and his foreign policy color my opinion on Russians and Russia.

I count Russians as some of the nicest people I have met and one day, after this is all over, I would like to go on vacation to Russia.

I dont think Russians are any more capable of murder, rape and heinous crimes than any other people .

It is easy to forget that in the USA and most of Europe we elect our politicians and we have a free press. If we elect a wrong 'un, we can throw them out. We get to hear both sides of the debate. Every time I hear some heinous views expressed by an extreme faction in the USA, my first reaction is "Ugh!", but my second reaction is "Ya know Im lucky to live in a country where people can say things that I strongly disagree with".

If you are Russian, you had no say in who your leader was. It is unfair to blame the everyday Russians for Putin's rise to power. The transition from a Communist dictatorship established by Stalin through Perestroika to a Criminal state run by an organized crime boss is one of the great tragedies of the final years of the 20th century. Nobody is paying a higher price for this than the Russians.

At least the Ukrainians have the option of fighting for their freedom.

What world do you live in ….?

and study your history and learn about the Washington consensus, forced privatization and the looting of Russian state assets by London bankers and Wall Street wide boys

The US is cursed to have citizens like you with such a poor grasp of history , events and knowledge

 

[LeoV]

So you do agree with me that is a mystery that the nice russians are supporting al of this.

 

[LeoV]

Putin just gave a speech;
He said the “special operation”, i.e. war, “may take a long time”, but it has “significant result, new territories”.

Russia is waging a war of territorial conquest in Ukraine and not hiding it.

https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/5707860

 

[LeoV]

It is unfair to blame the everyday Russians for Putin's rise to power.

Yes you can, the brutal killing of Nemtsov was their last opportunity to stop Putin.

 

[EYESAILOR]

I follow the German discussion ..the huge frustration of Germans over thier failing economy , pipe line destruction , bleak future and failure to use diplomacy to solve European issues

A Russian can only dream of enjoying the bleak outlook and failing economy that the average German enjoys. Data from here

	Germany	Russia
GDP per capita	$51,238	$12,219
Education Expenditure per capita	$2,395	$527
Healthcare Expenditure per capita	$5,594	$334
S&P Rating on government debt	AAA	CC