Washington 360 - Something interesting for next summer.

Roleur

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Orcas Island
https://nwmaritime.org/wa360/

We are signing up when it opens on January 15th.  I think it is a fantastic concept, especially given both Van Isle 360 and R2AK have been cancelled.  Super excited to have something interesting and different to look forward to next Summer.  

 

Mr Moab

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Will be the truest test of drifters, 1/2oz spinnakers and anchors ever imagined. 

but does sound interesting. 

 

Roleur

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Orcas Island
Pulling from the other thread that has already transitioned to the WA360...

Using Navionics I come up with just over 300nm, straight line, through the water, like a human powered vessel might go.  

FWIW, Dark Star did the Salish 200 which is very similar without the Tacoma to Olympia part and more of a straight line just to Patos, without the diversions in the WA360, in 36 hours.  The Salish 200 was generally very windy, by any standard, nevermind summer standards.  There is no way they could have done the 300nm in 48 hours, even on that windy year.  I bet it will take longer than 72 hours or the first running. 

I also don't see that catamarans and trimarans will have nearly the advantage over fast monohulls for this course and likely wind speed.  We've seen repeatedly that fast 35-45' monohulls can keep up with the faster trimarans in the Northern Century, which has the same type of challenges with light air and adverse currents.

i'm thinking there will be over 100 boats entered.  With all the other distance races and adventures cancelled next summer, the convenient start location, and the simplified boat requirements this will draw a crowd.  

 
The ideal boat for this thing is definitely of the Swiss lake racer variety. As in ultra-light over-canvassed catamaran.  And sure, a fast monohull might stay in contact with a Farrier trimaran in the light stuff, but when we did the Northern Century on the Marstrom M32 it was so light that we were the only boat that could finish the 100nm within the time limit.  No monohulls stayed in contact for more than the first 15min.  I don't have the M32 anymore, but we raced the boat in a wide range of conditions and only other fast cats like the SL33 or the Extreme40 were somewhat competitive on a boat-for-boat basis.  I'd take a 32-45' ultra-light catamaran racing 3-up over a TP52 for this race.

Northern Century 2015.jpg

WA360 is intriguing.  Especially after a year of virtually no racing for me.  On the other hand, getting down to Olympia looks potentially brutal:

Swantown Marina June 2020.JPG

I can't decide if this looks like fun or hate mission.

 

Left Shift

Super Anarchist
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Well, with depths in the Swinomish Channel running at about 8'* or so and the current running in Deception Pass running at 5-7 knots around then, the Narrows only slightly less and the full "schools-out!" powerboat fleet out in force, anyone is invited to try to sail through those areas...just not on my boat.  

Hate mission.  Full on.  

(* Yes, I know the target depth is 12', and the Port of LaConner keeps dredging away.  Just try it.)

 

Roleur

Super Anarchist
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Orcas Island
Well, with depths in the Swinomish Channel running at about 8'* or so and the current running in Deception Pass running at 5-7 knots around then, the Narrows only slightly less and the full "schools-out!" powerboat fleet out in force, anyone is invited to try to sail through those areas...just not on my boat.  

Hate mission.  Full on.  

(* Yes, I know the target depth is 12', and the Port of LaConner keeps dredging away.  Just try it.)
The currents are no more of a challenge than Seymour Narrows, right?  They are gates, requires some patience for good seamanship.  

 

Zonker

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I think the route MUST include Spokane and Walla Walla if you're going to call it a 360. Thus a fast tow vehicle and quick loading/unloading from trailer would start to matter more.

image.png

 
A

Amati

Guest
JimBowie said:
What is the ideal boat here?  The Melges 32, again?
This is where a Shelton stop would have been, um, interesting... :lol:

 
A

Amati

Guest
The ideal boat for this thing is definitely of the Swiss lake racer variety. As in ultra-light over-canvassed catamaran.  And sure, a fast monohull might stay in contact with a Farrier trimaran in the light stuff, but when we did the Northern Century on the Marstrom M32 it was so light that we were the only boat that could finish the 100nm within the time limit.  No monohulls stayed in contact for more than the first 15min.  I don't have the M32 anymore, but we raced the boat in a wide range of conditions and only other fast cats like the SL33 or the Extreme40 were somewhat competitive on a boat-for-boat basis.  I'd take a 32-45' ultra-light catamaran racing 3-up over a TP52 for this race.

View attachment 417330

WA360 is intriguing.  Especially after a year of virtually no racing for me.  On the other hand, getting down to Olympia looks potentially brutal:

View attachment 417332

I can't decide if this looks like fun or hate mission.
Potentially?  Ha!  Deadheads are an art form down there.....   I’m still shocked that Shelton isn’t on the itinerary, but it’s fun to check out.  Even Canoes go aground trying that one out...

 

Left Shift

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The currents are no more of a challenge than Seymour Narrows, right?  They are gates, requires some patience for good seamanship.  
Well, this is all my opinion, and not to get too far into the weeds (or kelp), but Deception Pass is 1/4 as wide as Seymour (300' vs .4 nm) and from the time you commit to going through until you're spit out, Deception is almost twice as long.  And LOTS busier.  I've sailed through both (and motored many times) and certainly in Seymour running with the current can be lumpy.  Wind against current is exciting.  But in Deception, running with the current, twice I've had whirlpools just grab a 36' boat and spin it 360° and toss it within a couple of feet of the rock wall of Pass I.  Then the ebb running over the shallows on the outside gets very square - a mini Nahwitti bar.  Of all the passes I've sailed through around here, including Deception, Active, Porlier, Gabriola, Dodge, Seymour, Nahwitti, The Narrows, Cattle and Yaculta, Deception is the one I'd never do again without the motor running.  Yet it can be a scenic joy ride in a powerboat.  

As for Swinomish, the problem really lies in the fact that the current direction is not predictable and it's 13 nm long from Strawberry Point to Cherry Point and 200' wide for a lot of it.  Just brutal stretch of rowing or cycling.  And it's really unpredictably shallow.  You certainly are't going to sail through there.  On my last boat, which drew 8.5 feet, we nudged the mud bottom 5 out of 6 times we went through there at theoretical "mid-tide" even after calling the harbormaster.  Slow learner, I guess, but the Port of LaConner cannot keep it dredged. 

So, yes, I think the currents/configuration are more of a challenge than Seymour for a non-motored race in anything other than an ocean kayak. 

If I was younger and stronger, a 2-person kayak or a longboat would be just about the right ride for the whole thing, actually. 

(BTW, I've even been on a 3/4 tonner when the owner went through Canoe Pass on the NORTH side of Deception on a full ebb.  As we approached, he swung the helm over that way as a joke (I guess) and we were caught in the current with no control.  I was very vocally not in favor and seriously holy fuckin' crap.  Do NOT ever even think about that. I still have no idea how we made it.)  

 
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Left Shift

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Seattle
I’m not sure what I’m missing, but why not just wait for the beginning or end of the ebb?1
That should be the plan, but slack water lasts for about 20 minutes and you've got 2.5 miles to go.  In a  good kayak or longboat, no problem and you can always play the shore.  In a sailboat that bicycles or sculls at 2 knots?  Not my personal cup of tea.

 
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grimoire

New member
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Oregon
I like the adventurous spirit and style of the R2AK, and hence this seems like fun. It does sound a bit bland drifting around, and rowing a yacht.

Maybe I'll drag my Santa Cruz 27 up for it.

So, why isn't there an offshore race down the Oregon and Northern California coast? For the trailer sailors, it would be a f'n gas and the logistics would be easy as pie. 

 

Ishmael

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48,170
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Fuctifino
I like the adventurous spirit and style of the R2AK, and hence this seems like fun. It does sound a bit bland drifting around, and rowing a yacht.

Maybe I'll drag my Santa Cruz 27 up for it.

So, why isn't there an offshore race down the Oregon and Northern California coast? For the trailer sailors, it would be a f'n gas and the logistics would be easy as pie. 
I'm not sure trailer sailors would survive. It can get gnarly out there with not a lot of places to hide.

 

Left Shift

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Seattle
1 hour ago, Veeger said:

I think that this could be a contender for the WA360  (okay, personally, I might do a different color...)


Isn't that a really just a buffed out International 110?   360 miles in that will give you a new appreciation for ergonomics!

Screen Shot 2020-12-29 at 11.00.39 AM.png

 
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