West Michigan Thread

@last

Anarchist
900
40
So much for the verbal commitment at the meeting, to each his own I guess. Am just happy that MYC is bringing 4 OD boats to the event, two more cities with that kind of representation and we would be set. :)
We may have this fixed! Should know by the end of the week. Level 35 section! :D
Excellent to hear! Good luck with getting a level section. That will make it so much easier on Ron.
Schock 35s and Thomas 35s from Chicago considering joining the fun. Question is, section like GL70s - still handicapped, or OD/level like T-10s?

I think GL70 style would be more palatable to all.
Nope. CYC won't allow it and is having fits about the GL-70's which is why getting this set up has been difficult. We will race level in the section and use the fastest rating of the section for the all the boats. Shocks have the fastest ratings in ORR. J/35 are slowest and a fair range within the J/35 fleet themselves. BD was IRR measured in 89 by the previous owner so they use those measurements for BD others get the 1d measurement or have only been free board measured. J35 and the Thomas's have raced level in Lake Huron for years very successfully. Going 1D and not having the 51 ft C&C in our class to waterline us to death if the wind kicks up on a reach :D
Gosh you weren't able to get them to apply that T-10 ORR rating to the level 35 class I had suggested? Would passing the hat and making "donations" to the RC help? Just kidding, thanks again for your hard work.

 

OffShore Sam

Member
287
0
So much for the verbal commitment at the meeting, to each his own I guess. Am just happy that MYC is bringing 4 OD boats to the event, two more cities with that kind of representation and we would be set. :)
We may have this fixed! Should know by the end of the week. Level 35 section! :D
Excellent to hear! Good luck with getting a level section. That will make it so much easier on Ron.
Schock 35s and Thomas 35s from Chicago considering joining the fun. Question is, section like GL70s - still handicapped, or OD/level like T-10s?

I think GL70 style would be more palatable to all.
Nope. CYC won't allow it and is having fits about the GL-70's which is why getting this set up has been difficult. We will race level in the section and use the fastest rating of the section for the all the boats. Shocks have the fastest ratings in ORR. J/35 are slowest and a fair range within the J/35 fleet themselves. BD was IRR measured in 89 by the previous owner so they use those measurements for BD others get the 1d measurement or have only been free board measured. J35 and the Thomas's have raced level in Lake Huron for years very successfully. Going 1D and not having the 51 ft C&C in our class to waterline us to death if the wind kicks up on a reach :D
 

BGeff

Super Anarchist
3,472
245
Ann Arbor, MI
Nope. CYC won't allow it and is having fits about the GL-70's which is why getting this set up has been difficult. We will race level in the section and use the fastest rating of the section for the all the boats. Shocks have the fastest ratings in ORR. J/35 are slowest and a fair range within the J/35 fleet themselves. BD was IRR measured in 89 by the previous owner so they use those measurements for BD others get the 1d measurement or have only been free board measured. J35 and the Thomas's have raced level in Lake Huron for years very successfully. Going 1D and not having the 51 ft C&C in our class to waterline us to death if the wind kicks up on a reach :D
Have you taken this up with the Chief Measurer of the Chi Mac race yet? I can bring it to his attention if you would like.

 

lartaunt

Super Anarchist
Who exactly at CYC is having an issue with the GL 70s?
Sam,

That particular comment I did not hear first hand as I turned this project over to one of our Chicago based owners who are enjoying retirement and have more time than I but It was a Sean (something) that my contact was talking to directly. Mentioned the GL-70's GL-36 class that had tried to combine non one design boats into a level fleet. Arguement is that in ORR there is significant range in the J/35 fleet alone let alone when you put in the Thomas and the Schock (which both owe time to the J/35 in ORR apparently) In our case the slowese rated J/35 would give up over an hour on handicap rating to the fleet in the MAC race if they used the fastest rating in the fleet as the level number, which is what they want us to do.

I don't really see that it is that difficult really, use the ORR handicap to score us in fleet and elaped time to score us in section. Apparently that is what they do in BYC race but CYC does not want to do that. Sounds like they have had some bad experiences before. I can understand that and it is their race. I think we will all ultimately agree to race level under their rules if they don't budge but it may not get done for this year. We only needed 1 more J/35 and we could have avoided this whole thing :(

 

lartaunt

Super Anarchist
Nope. CYC won't allow it and is having fits about the GL-70's which is why getting this set up has been difficult. We will race level in the section and use the fastest rating of the section for the all the boats. Shocks have the fastest ratings in ORR. J/35 are slowest and a fair range within the J/35 fleet themselves. BD was IRR measured in 89 by the previous owner so they use those measurements for BD others get the 1d measurement or have only been free board measured. J35 and the Thomas's have raced level in Lake Huron for years very successfully. Going 1D and not having the 51 ft C&C in our class to waterline us to death if the wind kicks up on a reach :D
Have you taken this up with the Chief Measurer of the Chi Mac race yet? I can bring it to his attention if you would like.
RW has been involved in the discussions and was the one who originally said a flat no to the level 35 idea. They have been more willing to talk about it since then and we seem to be making progress but again may not help for this year

 

BGeff

Super Anarchist
3,472
245
Ann Arbor, MI
Ok. Just thought I'd help with RW if I could. Glad at least it is being talked about. Maybe that one J35 will show up and take all the issues away.

 

OffShore Sam

Member
287
0
Who exactly at CYC is having an issue with the GL 70s?
Sam,

That particular comment I did not hear first hand as I turned this project over to one of our Chicago based owners who are enjoying retirement and have more time than I but It was a Sean (something) that my contact was talking to directly. Mentioned the GL-70's GL-36 class that had tried to combine non one design boats into a level fleet. Arguement is that in ORR there is significant range in the J/35 fleet alone let alone when you put in the Thomas and the Schock (which both owe time to the J/35 in ORR apparently) In our case the slowese rated J/35 would give up over an hour on handicap rating to the fleet in the MAC race if they used the fastest rating in the fleet as the level number, which is what they want us to do.

I don't really see that it is that difficult really, use the ORR handicap to score us in fleet and elaped time to score us in section. Apparently that is what they do in BYC race but CYC does not want to do that. Sounds like they have had some bad experiences before. I can understand that and it is their race. I think we will all ultimately agree to race level under their rules if they don't budge but it may not get done for this year. We only needed 1 more J/35 and we could have avoided this whole thing :(

Well, my issue was with stating that the CYC has/had an issue with the GL 70s. Not to say that there have not been issues over the years, but not an ORR issue. Our class has been a significant supporter of ORR. The issue may have been that CYC want to put non complying boats into the GL 70 class. When I say non complying I mean boats that do not comply with the GL 70 bylaws. If that is an issue,so be it as it would then just be an ORR class of whatever rating. Our class would simply rescore for the season standings within the class. That being said, we hope to keep sailing as a class.

And for what it is worth, Sean O'Neil has never voiced a word of issue to me about any issue.

Thanks for your response...

 

lartaunt

Super Anarchist
Well, my issue was with stating that the CYC has/had an issue with the GL 70s. Not to say that there have not been issues over the years, but not an ORR issue. Our class has been a significant supporter of ORR. The issue may have been that CYC want to put non complying boats into the GL 70 class. When I say non complying I mean boats that do not comply with the GL 70 bylaws. If that is an issue,so be it as it would then just be an ORR class of whatever rating. Our class would simply rescore for the season standings within the class. That being said, we hope to keep sailing as a class.

And for what it is worth, Sean O'Neil has never voiced a word of issue to me about any issue.

Thanks for your response...

Fair enough! I think CYC is tired of getting into the middle of "issues" period which is absolutely understandable. GL's were just an example we were given of a rating diverse one design. Bottom line they want it settled before not after which makes sense.

The GL-70's are still the coolest boat on the Lake as far as I am concerned even in their third decade. Just wish we would see them out to play more. Is the Muskegon GL 70 regatta on the schedule really happening?

 

fyschebone

Anarchist
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IslandGoat2010

Anarchist
217
0
Nope. CYC won't allow it and is having fits about the GL-70's which is why getting this set up has been difficult. We will race level in the section and use the fastest rating of the section for the all the boats. Shocks have the fastest ratings in ORR. J/35 are slowest and a fair range within the J/35 fleet themselves. BD was IRR measured in 89 by the previous owner so they use those measurements for BD others get the 1d measurement or have only been free board measured. J35 and the Thomas's have raced level in Lake Huron for years very successfully. Going 1D and not having the 51 ft C&C in our class to waterline us to death if the wind kicks up on a reach :D
Have you taken this up with the Chief Measurer of the Chi Mac race yet? I can bring it to his attention if you would like.
RW has been involved in the discussions and was the one who originally said a flat no to the level 35 idea. They have been more willing to talk about it since then and we seem to be making progress but again may not help for this year
Actually, the Level 35 section started out in the Chicago-Mac in the early '90s and was adopted afterwards by BYC.

Instigated by Lindy Thomas and a few other owners. Based on PHRF ratings. The rating bands were much tighter then - Js were level, T were level and the difference for Mac was 14:28 - very successful for a few years until the boats started to leave Chicago. So successful that it was even used in the Chicago NOOD for a while. Scoring varied a little from year to year, but....

In 1995 we had 21 boats on the line in PHRF 4 - 15 Js & 6 Ts - there were other boats with the same rating (66) in PHRF 3. In 1995, the boats were scored level in fleet and in section.

So, there IS precedent at CYC and for the Mac to provide sections on request and to keep boats like Challenge from muddying the competitive waters.

 

F395

Member
471
268
west mi
Are the new docks at Muskegon Yacht Club going to be completed by launch day ?
Depends when launch day is....

Are the new docks at Muskegon Yacht Club going to be completed by launch day ?
Depends when launch day is....
2011 MYC Race Schedule

Date Day Time Event

11 May-11 Wednesday 6:15 PM Wednesday Challenge Trophy Spring

14 May-11 Saturday 8:00 AM Launch Day-MYC

21-22 May-11 Sat/Sun See NOR MYC Melges 24 Regatta

 

lartaunt

Super Anarchist
Nope. CYC won't allow it and is having fits about the GL-70's which is why getting this set up has been difficult. We will race level in the section and use the fastest rating of the section for the all the boats. Shocks have the fastest ratings in ORR. J/35 are slowest and a fair range within the J/35 fleet themselves. BD was IRR measured in 89 by the previous owner so they use those measurements for BD others get the 1d measurement or have only been free board measured. J35 and the Thomas's have raced level in Lake Huron for years very successfully. Going 1D and not having the 51 ft C&C in our class to waterline us to death if the wind kicks up on a reach :D
Have you taken this up with the Chief Measurer of the Chi Mac race yet? I can bring it to his attention if you would like.
RW has been involved in the discussions and was the one who originally said a flat no to the level 35 idea. They have been more willing to talk about it since then and we seem to be making progress but again may not help for this year
Actually, the Level 35 section started out in the Chicago-Mac in the early '90s and was adopted afterwards by BYC.

Instigated by Lindy Thomas and a few other owners. Based on PHRF ratings. The rating bands were much tighter then - Js were level, T were level and the difference for Mac was 14:28 - very successful for a few years until the boats started to leave Chicago. So successful that it was even used in the Chicago NOOD for a while. Scoring varied a little from year to year, but....

In 1995 we had 21 boats on the line in PHRF 4 - 15 Js & 6 Ts - there were other boats with the same rating (66) in PHRF 3. In 1995, the boats were scored level in fleet and in section.

So, there IS precedent at CYC and for the Mac to provide sections on request and to keep boats like Challenge from muddying the competitive waters.
Thanks for filling in the History. My involvement with the fleet only goes back to 97!

 

lartaunt

Super Anarchist
Got an email from the Lake Express today. Thinking ahead to Queen's. One-way tickets in steerage are $95 + $10 fuel surcharge + $6 security surcharge. Premier seating one-way is $106.50 + the surcharges.

http://www.lake-express.com/pricing/index.aspx

Time for me to finally do the Tripp Cup.
Or a weather dependent motoring alternative. One year it was glass calm and we motored over. Had someone up the mast trying to re-feed a halyard and we all "fell asleep" back down on the deck. Eventually got woken up by his screaming about numbness in sensative areas. :lol:

 
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