What’s next for J?

Swimsailor

Swimsailor

Super Anarchist
4,734
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WA
Blur said:
To summarize, a bigger J/121, built like a J/125 at a Beneteau price point  :lol: :lol: :lol:

J/boats understand the difference between what crew dreams about, and what owners actually buy, and by now they have lots of data points.

I would be first in line for a sportier J/121, but then there are many options including a custom build. Or a Class 40. Or sensible/economic options like the Xp-44 or Swan 42/45 that you can own for 3-4 years to do the bucket list races and re-sell quite easily. This is a tough segment with picky owners.

As hinted above, the natural step is probably the J/141 (J/121 but in J/145 size) were the feedback from the J/121 could be used to make a perfect Transpac ride for people to old for the J/125.
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As long as we can call it a "one forty one".  Even in the interview, Stu used "one twenty one".

 
Monkey

Monkey

Super Anarchist
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Alaris said:
I agree with you there, it could use some more rig IMO. Stability is probably fine with water ballast, add crew if you like for max speed or maybe a heavier keel. The hull shape is probably one of the better (best?) big boats J has designed excluding the 125/145. 
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Why not just do a 121S?  They could use almost all the existing tooling, then just toss a bigger stick on it and cut down a bit on the furniture. 

 
Alaris

Alaris

Super Anarchist
1,904
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Annapolis
Blur said:
To summarize, a bigger J/121, built like a J/125 at a Beneteau price point  :lol: :lol: :lol:

J/boats understand the difference between what crew dreams about, and what owners actually buy, and by now they have lots of data points.

I would be first in line for a sportier J/121, but then there are many options including a custom build. Or a Class 40. Or sensible/economic options like the Xp-44 or Swan 42/45 that you can own for 3-4 years to do the bucket list races and re-sell quite easily. This is a tough segment with picky owners.

As hinted above, the natural step is probably the J/141 (J/121 but in J/145 size) were the feedback from the J/121 could be used to make a perfect Transpac ride for people to old for the J/125.
Click to expand...
When J/Boats made a boat that was pretty close to what we wanted, but a little underpowered, we bought a hull and built the rest. 26 years later we’re still pleased with the result. What Loki did isn’t far off (although we changed foils too).

 
Raz'r

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
63,500
6,066
De Nile
Roleur said:
Exactly.  We just finished our 18th double-handed race of the year on our J/111.  At least 12 more planned for the remainder of the year.  
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ya bastard  B)

My daughter and I have our first one planned for Saturday

 
B

Bad Andy

Anarchist
990
56
Chicago
Roleur said:
Sounds like it would rate something like 12 sec/mile slower than a J/125 then?  That's not bad considering it would be easier to shorthand and more comfortable in general.  Isn't the base rating of a 121 closer to 30?  
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garyedelman said:
Loki the J/121 raced The Hook Race with a PHRF rating of 3.  She went up about 4 feet in the mast. 

She took 3rd in PHRF 2, losing to a Farr 40 rating -12, and a J/160 rating -6.
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PHRF should have been closer to 9 or 12 but it was done rather hastily because of the Mac race cancellation.  The boat sails great with the new rig, nice and powerful upwind and great horsepower off the wind, much better for Chicago/Great Lakes.  I didn't sail on the boat much before the new rig  but word was that it was sticky even with the bigger square top on the stock rig. 

Rig is 5' taller, 22% square top, lots of fun Code Zeros and the water ballast inlets have been glassed over (rating hit wasn't worth it).

 
IMR

IMR

Anarchist
593
125
SF Bay Area
Blur said:
To summarize, a bigger J/121, built like a J/125 at a Beneteau price point  :lol: :lol: :lol:

J/boats understand the difference between what crew dreams about, and what owners actually buy, and by now they have lots of data points.

I would be first in line for a sportier J/121, but then there are many options including a custom build. Or a Class 40. Or sensible/economic options like the Xp-44 or Swan 42/45 that you can own for 3-4 years to do the bucket list races and re-sell quite easily. This is a tough segment with picky owners.

As hinted above, the natural step is probably the J/141 (J/121 but in J/145 size) were the feedback from the J/121 could be used to make a perfect Transpac ride for people to old for the J/125.
Click to expand...
I was the youngest guy on the Velvet Hammer at 37 last year for Transpac. We had guys up into their late 50’s. I would put the average age of our crew at 45 years old without doing the math. 

 
jackolantern

jackolantern

Super Anarchist
1,748
567
Alaris said:
When J/Boats made a boat that was pretty close to what we wanted, but a little underpowered, we bought a hull and built the rest. 26 years later we’re still pleased with the result. What Loki did isn’t far off (although we changed foils too).
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What 26 year old j/boat did you turbo? 

 
Alaris

Alaris

Super Anarchist
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743
Annapolis
Swimsailor said:
We gotta see this!
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Carbon Hall rig 7’ taller than stock, masthead (136m2) and fractional (89m2) kites 

7’ keel (looks like a J/125 without as long a trailing edge on the bulb)

Carbon/GRP rudder (looks like a J/111)

155% genoa

500lb lighter than a stock boat

64520F7D-BEDC-459D-8284-5F4235DAF519.jpeg

 
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F

F18 Sailor

Super Anarchist
2,687
262
Annapolis, MD
Nice setup on Muskrat!

The J/120 owner I'm sailing with and I considered the J/145 briefly before the 120 (we're both fast cat sailors so have speed addiction syndrome)...draft was an issue, as is cost of sails for that boat. Still, what a weapon, basically a cruisable, faster version of the J/125. Several were available for about the same as some of the tricked out J/125's, including a new suite of sails and a reasonable level of work.

If they did something similar to the 145, built to a similar weight ,with water ballast and modern sail handling equipment, it could sell, but probably in limited numbers as that is aggressive for the non-racing sailor. Draft on a true 45' performance boat remains an issue on the U.S East Coast, partly why the J/120 is a great offshore boat and competitive Chesapeake boat, coupled with the reasonable price and solid build, it matched the owners needs well.

Going forward, the water ballast issue on handicap is challenging, maybe with COVID and short handed sailing the new norm some of the restrictions will ease up and the ~50% of 121's that aren't sailing with water ballast as a result will switch.

 
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