What brands from the 70s/80s would you resurrect?

[VWAP]

Gramps says sidney sabots

whatever those are

 

[sledracr]

+1s to Ericson, Barient

...plus Schock (now just a shell of what they were)

 

[SailMoore1]

My first boat was a Sidney Sabot. Great little boat, but not really any better or worse than the dozens of other sabot manufacturers. My vote would be the boats out of Santa Cruz.

 

[Jubblies]

I always wondered what a J22 with a retractable bulb keel, cut out transom and a bow sprit would look like, and then the J70 came

 

[SloopJonB]

Barient

Don't really need them back - their stuff was so good that most of it is still around. It sure outlives the boats it was mounted on.

 

[Laker]

Dash 34 - only built properly with vacuum bagging, modern rudder and keel foil, and a carbon rig.  Still a great design (see the FP picture of Midnight Rambler which looks like a Dash 34 from above) but needed better execution than what was available at the time.

Laurie wanted to build that boat with a lot less freeboard, but one of the backers was a tall person, so it had to have standing headroom for 6'2" I believe.  The lower freeboard may have also helped.  In many ways like the Kirby 30s where Bruce was given a draft limit by the builders that was way too little.  (for Lac St. Louis near Montreal)  The Kirby 30 with a decent keel would be a good return.

 

[12 metre]

Laurie wanted to build that boat with a lot less freeboard, but one of the backers was a tall person, so it had to have standing headroom for 6'2" I believe.  The lower freeboard may have also helped.  In many ways like the Kirby 30s where Bruce was given a draft limit by the builders that was way too little.  (for Lac St. Louis near Montreal)  The Kirby 30 with a decent keel would be a good return.

The "tall backer" couldn't have been Finn .  I suspect he was short of cash as well as stature - although maybe he received a wad of cash from the insurer for the Riotous Assembly bonfire IDK.

I like the Dash and own one - but nowhere near 6'2" headroom.  Maybe 5'10" or so at best - I"m 6'2" and have to slouch a bit inside.  But I'm okay with that on any boat so long as I don't have to bend my back. 

The story I heard was similar but a slightly different twist - they ended up making the cabin taller was the one I heard - but your freeboard one sounds more likely - they do have a fair amount of freeboard.

Great boats but could use more SA and RM IMO.  The keel always seemed to me like it was designed more for marketing purposes -  pretty much every boat of that era designed with aspirations of racing in mind had to have a trapezoidal keel like the IOR boats.  While generally a good hydrodynamic planform it also results in a keel with high CG, which doesn't really suit a relatively narrow boat like the Dash (10' beam), and especially one with such a narrow BWL (<8 ft).

Rudder had an odd and rather small planform and my gut tells me LD didn't design that.

Rig wise, I've wondered if a MH version of sufficient height would have worked out better.  My understanding is that the Dash 34 was sort of a followup of LD's Wednesday Night Racer (there are some comments and photos of the WNR design in either "A Lighter Ton" or "Charge of the Light Brigade" - one of the two) which looked like a MH version of the Dash with a shorter cabin IIRC.

 

[Maxx Baqustae]

The "tall backer" couldn't have been Finn .  I suspect he was short of cash as well as stature - although maybe he received a wad of cash from the insurer for the Riotous Assembly bonfire IDK.

I like the Dash and own one - but nowhere near 6'2" headroom.  Maybe 5'10" or so at best - I"m 6'2" and have to slouch a bit inside.  But I'm okay with that on any boat so long as I don't have to bend my back. 

The story I heard was similar but a slightly different twist - they ended up making the cabin taller was the one I heard - but your freeboard one sounds more likely - they do have a fair amount of freeboard.

Great boats but could use more SA and RM IMO.  The keel always seemed to me like it was designed more for marketing purposes -  pretty much every boat of that era designed with aspirations of racing in mind had to have a trapezoidal keel like the IOR boats.  While generally a good hydrodynamic planform it also results in a keel with high CG, which doesn't really suit a relatively narrow boat like the Dash (10' beam), and especially one with such a narrow BWL (<8 ft).

Rudder had an odd and rather small planform and my gut tells me LD didn't design that.

Rig wise, I've wondered if a MH version of sufficient height would have worked out better.  My understanding is that the Dash 34 was sort of a followup of LD's Wednesday Night Racer (there are some comments and photos of the WNR design in either "A Lighter Ton" or "Charge of the Light Brigade" - one of the two) which looked like a MH version of the Dash with a shorter cabin IIRC.

Do mean like this? 

 

[Maxx Baqustae]

Fredricksen, Penguin, Barbarossa, Ratsy & Lapthorn, Horizon Sails?

Sails by Watts! 

 

[12 metre]

Do mean like this? 

View attachment 294097

Not exactly what I had in mind... :mellow:

 

[TheFugitive]

I would 100% revive the Hotfoot Brand! While the Hotfoot team may not have been the best business people, Doug Hemphill got something very right with the 27, 30, and 31! I wish they'd stuck around long enough to make a 37 or 40!

 

[Alex W]

It would be fun to see what Express/Alsberg would do in 2018, but I think that a lot of the heart in the brand came from Carl Schumacher who sadly wouldn't be designing the current boats.  Likewise I'd love to see what Olson would do these days.

I think C&C is a good choice otherwise.  Has anyone has as solid of a run making racer/cruisers across the years?

Hotfoot is an interesting choice.  I heavily considered a Hotfoot 31 (before buying the Express 37) and just couldn't come to an agreement on price with the seller.  I liked the design a lot and it was fun to sail.

 

[Foreverslow]

Hobie 33

Sabre 34 & 38 MKIIs

S2 7.9

Frers 36

 

[Rain Man]

The "tall backer" couldn't have been Finn .  I suspect he was short of cash as well as stature - although maybe he received a wad of cash from the insurer for the Riotous Assembly bonfire IDK.

I like the Dash and own one - but nowhere near 6'2" headroom.  Maybe 5'10" or so at best - I"m 6'2" and have to slouch a bit inside.  But I'm okay with that on any boat so long as I don't have to bend my back. 

The story I heard was similar but a slightly different twist - they ended up making the cabin taller was the one I heard - but your freeboard one sounds more likely - they do have a fair amount of freeboard.

Great boats but could use more SA and RM IMO.  The keel always seemed to me like it was designed more for marketing purposes -  pretty much every boat of that era designed with aspirations of racing in mind had to have a trapezoidal keel like the IOR boats.  While generally a good hydrodynamic planform it also results in a keel with high CG, which doesn't really suit a relatively narrow boat like the Dash (10' beam), and especially one with such a narrow BWL (<8 ft).

Rudder had an odd and rather small planform and my gut tells me LD didn't design that.

Rig wise, I've wondered if a MH version of sufficient height would have worked out better.  My understanding is that the Dash 34 was sort of a followup of LD's Wednesday Night Racer (there are some comments and photos of the WNR design in either "A Lighter Ton" or "Charge of the Light Brigade" - one of the two) which looked like a MH version of the Dash with a shorter cabin IIRC.

The "tall backer" definitely could not stand up in the boat, except under the open hatch, but he could sleep in all the berths!  I think we agree that a bit more RM would allow more SA especially downwind, which is the boat's weak point.

The rumour about the rudder is that there was a mould lying around the shop for another boat, and it was close in size and shape, so they didn't bother building a new one according to the design from LD.  When I ground mine down to the glass last year for fairing it looked like they had taken a rudder from another boat, installed a slightly longer shaft and built up a few inches around the shaft at the top of the rudder.  The top two inches of the rudder was a different layup.  Definitely a frankenrudder.

 

[jerseyguy]

It would be fun to see what Express/Alsberg would do in 2018, but I think that a lot of the heart in the brand came from Carl Schumacher who sadly wouldn't be designing the current boats.  Likewise I'd love to see what Olson would do these days.

I think C&C is a good choice otherwise.  Has anyone has as solid of a run making racer/cruisers across the years?

Hotfoot is an interesting choice.  I heavily considered a Hotfoot 31 (before buying the Express 37) and just couldn't come to an agreement on price with the seller.  I liked the design a lot and it was fun to sail.

Alsberg brothers and Carl Schumacher.  YES!,

 

[12 metre]

I would 100% revive the Hotfoot Brand! While the Hotfoot team may not have been the best business people, Doug Hemphill got something very right with the 27, 30, and 31! I wish they'd stuck around long enough to make a 37 or 40!

I've always been a fan of the Hotfoots (have owned 2 - hull #1 and #2 in various eras).   May have been a bit on the pricey side at the time.  Their main problem IMO was coming to market around 1981 - just as the local economy went into a huge recession.  The same could possibly be said for Dash Marine as well.

 

[12 metre]

The "tall backer" definitely could not stand up in the boat, except under the open hatch, but he could sleep in all the berths!  I think we agree that a bit more RM would allow more SA especially downwind, which is the boat's weak point.

The rumour about the rudder is that there was a mould lying around the shop for another boat, and it was close in size and shape, so they didn't bother building a new one according to the design from LD.  When I ground mine down to the glass last year for fairing it looked like they had taken a rudder from another boat, installed a slightly longer shaft and built up a few inches around the shaft at the top of the rudder.  The top two inches of the rudder was a different layup.  Definitely a frankenrudder.

View attachment 294101

I think Lebron James could sleep in all the berths.

I heard a similar rumour about the rudder and it is the most likely explanation.

 

[Crash]

I think C&C is a good choice otherwise.  Has anyone has as solid of a run making racer/cruisers across the years?

J-Boats?  1977 to present.  But they are not really a builder, so don't know if we can count them in the same way you'd count C&C, etc

 

[ss123]

Evelyn

 

[il1395]

Lindenberg 26.......extended 2 feet to make the cockpit bigger, open transom, slightly deeper and modern keel, lower boom.