What is your actual liability if someone dies on your boat?

Rasputin22

Rasputin22
14,588
4,118
When I was young and got my first blue water passage on a big Hinckley 64 ketch I was thrilled. The boat was privately owned with a full time captain and chef crew. The boat had done its Caribbean winter tour and was bound back to New England via Bermuda and I was asked to join them. Sailing into Bermuda was fascinating to me and we had our first (of many) Dark and Stormies. The next morning and it was time to top off fuel and water tanks and the skipper went to great lengths to show me exactly which fill fitting (and its type) was in the waterways around the deck. He told me to quit rubbernecking at the many fine racing yachts lining up for a start just in front of the Royal Bermuda Yacht Club where we were staying.

He left to go sort things out with the club office and said we would all have to go to the Customs House when he returned to clear in with Immigrations so I was to have all tanks topped off and closed up and the deck hosed down by the time he got back. I was about half way through when I heard the sounds of UBS Switzerland tacking just off of the club docks and I was mesmerized at the sight of such a much admired boat. I heard the water bubble up between my feet as I sat on the bulwark and looked down to see nothing but diesel fuel running down the scuppers! I had but water into the rather small day tank amidships and my daydreaming was the culprit.

After the explicit instructions and cautions from the skipper I knew he would be livid and I simply cleaned up the mess I had made and went below to pack my duffle and was getting off the boat as I was sure that would be my fate when the skipper returned. His wife told me to forget leaving the boat to hitchhike back to the Islands as no one would be heading that way that time of year and besides, we weren't officially cleared in yet. She said that the best I could do was finish filling the rest of the tanks without letting any diesel from my fuckup get in the harbor and gave me a big wad of those oil/diesel absorbing 'diapers'. She said I should keep a sharp eye out for the Skipper returning and that I should meet him at the head our dock and confess to my misdeeds on the spot. That seemed to work but I did get a totally deserved chewing out that my Navy Captain father would have been greatly impressed. The skipper called a disposal mitigation service to meet us at the boat after returning from the Customs and Immigration headquarters just down the street.

Bermuda takes its formalities very seriously and the old Bahamian gent who checked up in was uniformed to the utmost and his paperwork was filled out in the handscript of monk and his accent was so proper compared to the patois I was used to further down in the Antilles. The old fellow was going through the arrival checklist asking each question of the skipper in the most grave and serious manner. As he got to the end he looked at the 'port of embarkation' listed as St Martin and asked, "Since departing St Martin, have there been any deaths on board your vessel?"

The skipper took a deep breath and shot me a look that could kill and answered in an equally serious tone, "No sir... Not yet!!!"
 

Beer fueled Mayhem

Anarchist
686
232
Ballard, WA
Is anybody making their crew sign waivers to race on your boat? The boat I crew on isn't doing that but we buoy race so...
I am planning on doing Swiftsure (distance race) this year on my boat. I'll have 4 of my son's friends (all 18 year olds...) along. Have to say, I'm definitely considering the waiver. Don't know how well it would hold up in court but, if anything, it can open the eyes of the parents that racing can be deadly and don't assume everything is going to be okay.
I haven't had the Come to Jesus talk with any of the parents yet also. We are just getting the crew together. The boys are all over 18, so legally adults. :unsure:
 

mckenzie.keith

Aspiring Anarchist
1,474
583
Santa Cruz
1. [...]You should require the owner to provide a written agreement to hold you harmless and to indemnify you for any liability arising from your operation of the vessel. [...] The owner would be smart to make gross negligence, criminal behavior or similar egregious bad behavior on your part to be exceptions to his holding you harmless. You could also try to purchase Professional Liability insurance for your own account, if available and affordable. This kind of coverage is difficult to find and won't be cheap, but would be quite valuable in the event someone sues you, alleging you were somehow negligent, when operating the vessel, of causing bodily injury or property damage to a third party.
Indemnify and hold harmless? If a delivery skipper handed me that there is no way I would sign it, although the exceptions would make it somewhat more palatable. If the delivery skipper killed somebody and the heirs sued the delivery skipper, you would have to pay the judgement. I doubt your insurance would cover that. If the skipper needs to be insured, then the skipper should buy insurance. The cost can be passed on to customers. Or the owner can add the skipper to the existing policy. But it would be really stupid to indemnify and hold harmless a delivery skipper.

Then again, I am not a lawyer. So I might be wrong.
 

Peter Andersen

Super Anarchist
1,218
277
Is anybody making their crew sign waivers to race on your boat? The boat I crew on isn't doing that but we buoy race so...
I am planning on doing Swiftsure (distance race) this year on my boat. I'll have 4especially of my son's friends (all 18 year olds...) along. Have to say, I'm definitely considering the waiver. Don't know how well it would hold up in court but, if anything, it can open the eyes of the parents that racing can be deadly and don't assume everything is going to be okay.
I haven't had the Come to Jesus talk with any of the parents yet also. We are just getting the crew together. The boys are all over 18, so legally adults. :unsure:
The waivers are useless especially if you are found negligent and they dont stop you from being sued anyway. If you arent negligent you are covered by insurance .
 

EYESAILOR

Super Anarchist
3,802
2,316
If someone is going to be killed on your boat and you want to avoid liability, the same three general principles apply as apply on land:

1. Dispose of the weapon

2. Dispose of the body

3. Obtain a watertight alibi.

Like every other racing boat owner on this thread, I have wanted to kill my crew at one time or another. But it really does avoid a lot of headache to give them a second chance.
 

Beer fueled Mayhem

Anarchist
686
232
Ballard, WA
The waivers are useless especially if you are found negligent and they dont stop you from being sued anyway. If you arent negligent you are covered by insurance .
I was thinking exactly like this. And no way would I sign anything that says if the skipper is negligent, I can't sue. Not that I'm quick to do something like that...
 
The waivers are useless especially if you are found negligent and they dont stop you from being sued anyway. If you arent negligent you are covered by insurance .
Huh?

If you are not negligent, you are not liable for damages and won't need insurance. If you are negligent (civil negligence) and have a good insurance policy you should be covered.

Nothing stops you from being sued.

A "Hold harmless" waiver will not stop the suit but it may prevent an unfavorable outcome
 
Is anybody making their crew sign waivers to race on your boat? The boat I crew on isn't doing that but we buoy race so...
Almost all well run series and sailing events require skipper and crew to sign a waiver.
I am planning on doing Swiftsure (distance race) this year on my boat. I'll have 4 of my son's friends (all 18 year olds...) along. Have to say, I'm definitely considering the waiver.
Good
Don't know how well it would hold up in court but,
Hold harmless waivers in sports are a well established area of the law. A competent attorney will explain what works and what will not work.
If you have a large boat with a large insurance premium, your insurance company wil point you in the right direction. Otherwise I am sure that @MR.CLEAN will do a good a job as anyone. Its not rocket science, but nor should it be a home-build.
if anything, it can open the eyes of the parents that racing can be deadly and don't assume everything is going to be okay.
More importantly it will prevent a plaintiff claiming that you concealed or failed to notify your crew of the risks and dangers of the activity. This would constitute negligence.
I haven't had the Come to Jesus talk with any of the parents yet also. We are just getting the crew together. The boys are all over 18, so legally adults. :unsure:
 

mckenzie.keith

Aspiring Anarchist
1,474
583
Santa Cruz
True dat.
Are you a lawyer? If you were going to have a boat delivered and the delivery skipper asked you to sign a contract with an indemnify and hold harmless clause, would you sign it? Wouldn't it be better to figure out how to get the skipper covered by an acceptable insurance policy rather than have the boat owner essentially become the liability insurer for the delivery skipper for the duration of the journey?
 

Peter Andersen

Super Anarchist
1,218
277
Huh?

If you are not negligent, you are not liable for damages and won't need insurance. If you are negligent (civil negligence) and have a good insurance policy you should be covered.

Nothing stops you from being sued.

A "Hold harmless" waiver will not stop the suit but it may prevent an unfavorable outcome
Your first sentence is what I said except, you will need the insurance to defend yourself.

Attend a baseball game. The back of the ticket says the ownership cannot be held liable for injury due to batted balls into the stands. Your star player from the Dominican Republic is in the on deck circle smashing autographed fungos to excited fans in the stands before the game. One of them hits your 4 yr old in the head rendering him a vegetable. How worthy is your hold harmless waiver?
 

mckenzie.keith

Aspiring Anarchist
1,474
583
Santa Cruz
If someone is going to be killed on your boat and you want to avoid liability, the same three general principles apply as apply on land:

1. Dispose of the weapon

2. Dispose of the body

3. Obtain a watertight alibi.

Like every other racing boat owner on this thread, I have wanted to kill my crew at one time or another. But it really does avoid a lot of headache to give them a second chance.
It may be part of number 3, not sure, but you have to also give some thought to how to deal with any witnesses.
 
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