which side are you on?

[See Level]

With licence comes responsibility,

Maybe unfortunately, With responsibility comes consequences.

 

[frozenhawaiian]

I'm inclined to believe the USCG and FBI who cleared him over a year ago rather than the corrupt a shit USVI government and  pontius' family. I'm also inclined to trust the first hand account I was told of one of the crew who was on board when this happened. and not nothing the the community of people people running working sailing vessels on the maine coast is both small and tight knit. rick smith is not the type to just sail away and do nothing in the case of an MOB, regardless of circumstances. 

 

[Parma]

I have a perfectly normal, well loved by friends and family, family member who became sick with late onset schizophrenia at age 55.  He would switch back and forth from seemly normal to totally paranoid when off his meds, a big problem with this illness, (they feel better so they stop taking it).   Tin foil hat, several 6 week stints in a mental ward, real, shaking fear of and running inside at the site of any airplane,  same with gubmit surveillance,....... all of it.  At his worst he punched a colleague at an academic conference.  If you met him on the street he might be as normal as you and I but a few hours later he could be crazy.  Casual acquaintances have no idea.  We, family & good friends, look after him, it can be heart breaking.  Thankfully he has been doing very well the last 5 - 7 years.  However, I know him very well and sometimes I can tell he isn't the same old person.  I say this because you might never know if someone is truly crazy.  As for adequate vetting, Capt Smith would never know as medical history is confidential.  My family member had police called to his home a couple times but I don't think he was ever arrested so that might be a dead end.  Perhaps Pontious was sick in this way.  These people are really crazy and can do crazy things spontaneously, up to and including murder.    Smith could easily have concern for his safety while no one else would have a clue as to how crazy Pontious might be.  OTOH I think Capt Smith should have at least made a show of a search for the MOB and notified authorities or, as suggested, put Pontious ashore and/or called police once there.  I'd certainly give Smith the benefit of the doubt if his other crew testify that Pontious was acting crazy.  It could be that Pontious was just seasick and agitated until he really went off his rocker where upon he confronted Capt Smith in a hostile way then just jumped overboard.  Behaviour can be very spontaneous and unexpected.  Maybe Pontious was so paranoid that he though his life was in danger and his only escape was to jump overboard.  The above speculations could certainly happen in my family members case.  However I do think a review of Smith's captain's license (concerning his lack of MOB action) should be up for review.   Hopefully justice will be found.  I wish peace for Pontious' family and Cp Smith. This sounds awful for both.

Yep, and I would not want to risk my own safety and those of 2 others in order to bring a big strong crazy man who is trying to kill you back aboard either. That's just.....crazy.

I would bet that if they had brought Pontious back aboard and he had harmed someone they would be suing Smith for that instead.

 

[kent_island_sailor]

Yep, and I would not want to risk my own safety and those of 2 others in order to bring a big strong crazy man who is trying to kill you back aboard either. That's just.....crazy.

I would bet that if they had brought Pontious back aboard and he had harmed someone they would be suing Smith for that instead.

Like I said - they needed to at least fake it. Throw something over, sail around in circles, motor back and forth, fail to find the guy, and go on home. "He was a PITA and he sank anyway" is not going to look good in court.

 

[Swanno]

Like I said - they needed to at least fake it. Throw something over, sail around in circles, motor back and forth, fail to find the guy, and go on home. "He was a PITA and he sank anyway" is not going to look good in court.

Bingo. Throw something for him to float with and hand him a rope until he settles his shit down.

 

[Ishmael]

Bingo. Throw something for him to float with and hand him a rope until he settles his shit down.

Towing him for more than a hundred miles or so could get really tiresome.

 

[Swanno]

Towing him for more than a hundred miles or so could get really tiresome.

He won't be fighty 

 

[TQA]

I think the skipper has to make at least a token effort. MOB drill plus some searching.

BUT I would have the zip tie restraints ready and that loonie would spend the rest of the passage tied into his bunk. 

 

[blip]

I have known Rick Smith in the sailing community in Maine for many years and have to say I can totally see him throwing a life jacket 72 hours later and saying something like, "At least we can say we tried".  I've always thought he was a dirt bag and I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.  This is not surprising.  I mean, so the guy went under for a few seconds?  It didn't mean he was dead and Rick didn't make even the SLIGHTEST EFFORT to find him.  Jesus.  Cold.  I like the suggestions of letting the guy exhaust himself (while being safe) and them bringing him back aboard.  It sounds like he was definitely dehydrated and that can mess with your head.  He should have been calling for outside help and heading to the nearest port when the problem started to get serious.  Manslaughter.

 

[carcrash]

Mutiny. Mutiny at sea.

Don’t do that. Crew have been thrown overboard, keel hauled (ripped to pieces), and hung.

 

[carcrash]

Mutiny. Mutiny at sea.

Don’t do that. Crew have been thrown overboard, keel hauled (ripped to pieces), and hung.

However, since 1948 apparently, now mutiny is only a fine and up to 5 years in prison.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2192

 

[Blue Crab Rock Hall]

This is a tragic story. I met Captain Smith a few weeks ago here in St. Thomas and have had numerous conversations with him about this horrible situation. Being a blue water passage making charter captain myself, I fully understand the mental, physical and psychological challenges that go with the territory. However, in this case, I believe the captain's state of mind at the time of the incident was purely focused on the defense of himself, his crew and his boat.  I would conclude that his subsequent actions were not negligence, but self-defense. Any attempt to bring the attacker back onboard the vessel would have invited more deadly incidents, putting the lives of his crew and himself  right back into harm's way. Given the conditions - 350 miles from anywhere, night time on a small boat, high seas and brisk wind, most likely sleep deprived captain and crew, and an uncontrollable, violent crew member that the captain had never met before - If Captain Smith was, indeed, attacked - and if Pontius did, in fact, jump over the side, then, Smith should not be found guilty of manslaughter and should be exonerated by the court as he was by the US Coast Guard at the time of the incident three years ago. Were there there things that could have been done differently? Of course - but, hindsight is always 20-20.

 

[zenmasterfred]

Remind me not to book passage with said Capt. Smith.  Sounds like the situation got out of control unnecessarily, but WTF, who am I to judge, I wasn't there.  Seems some kind of intervention with 3 "sane/able" crew should have been possible though.

 

[Bull City]

Based on the account in the newspaper, it could be argued that it was nearly self-defense.

Very strange situation. Lesson: know your crew.

 

[kent_island_sailor]

This is a tragic story. I met Captain Smith a few weeks ago here in St. Thomas and have had numerous conversations with him about this horrible situation. Being a blue water passage making charter captain myself, I fully understand the mental, physical and psychological challenges that go with the territory. However, in this case, I believe the captain's state of mind at the time of the incident was purely focused on the defense of himself, his crew and his boat.  I would conclude that his subsequent actions were not negligence, but self-defense. Any attempt to bring the attacker back onboard the vessel would have invited more deadly incidents, putting the lives of his crew and himself  right back into harm's way. Given the conditions - 350 miles from anywhere, night time on a small boat, high seas and brisk wind, most likely sleep deprived captain and crew, and an uncontrollable, violent crew member that the captain had never met before - If Captain Smith was, indeed, attacked - and if Pontius did, in fact, jump over the side, then, Smith should not be found guilty of manslaughter and should be exonerated by the court as he was by the US Coast Guard at the time of the incident three years ago. Were there there things that could have been done differently? Of course - but, hindsight is always 20-20.

I didn't say to actually retrieve the guy, but you have to make it look like you tried

 

[eastern motors]

Here are the circumstances of that night as I understand them: This was the third day at sea; 350 miles offshore, 10 pm, 18 knots TWS, 10 ft seas, hard on the wind, with jib, staysail, main and mizzen. Pontius was around100 lbs heavier than Smith, and had been trying to wrestle control of the helm for hours. He had tried to strangle Smith and had punched him repeatedly. When Pepper tried to pull him off he had said "he'd be next". After a lull in his attempt at mutiny, Pontius stood up and said something to the effect of "alright then", stepped over the leeward lifeline and jumped into the water. The back of his head banged the cap rail as he went in and straight down. Bubbles were seen but no sign of him resurfacing in the beam of the flashlight. Smith's primary concern at that moment was for his own safety, safety of the other crew and the boat. He was relieved  that the threat was over when Pontius jumped overboard. Smith had no Satphone, and navigates using Navionics charts on an I-Pad that requires a code to access. He broadcast a Mayday with coordinates on SSB. Though Smith heard no response,It was picked up by a participant in a rally for cruisers and relayed to the USCG in Norfolk logged in at 0500 Zulu. There is no autopilot. The two other crew did not have much experience, and had been cowed by the strength and antics of Pontius. They were traumatized and didn't speak for the rest of the trip.The USCG was subsequently contacted by Chris Parker , the weather router after a scheduled SSB call by Smith many hours later. The USCG advised mariners in the area to keep a lookout. A plane was dispatched to search for Pontius ... A tragedy all round.

View attachment 293584

Sounds like Pontius was using deadly force against the captain (and arguably crew with his mutiny) and could have lawfully been killed in self defense.   

 

[nolatom]

Trial is set for this month, I believe.  Anyone going to sit in?  Or a newspaper reporter we trust, such as in the Clear Lake / Dinius trial?

 

[Monkey]

This is a tragic story. I met Captain Smith a few weeks ago here in St. Thomas and have had numerous conversations with him about this horrible situation. Being a blue water passage making charter captain myself, I fully understand the mental, physical and psychological challenges that go with the territory. However, in this case, I believe the captain's state of mind at the time of the incident was purely focused on the defense of himself, his crew and his boat.  I would conclude that his subsequent actions were not negligence, but self-defense. Any attempt to bring the attacker back onboard the vessel would have invited more deadly incidents, putting the lives of his crew and himself  right back into harm's way. Given the conditions - 350 miles from anywhere, night time on a small boat, high seas and brisk wind, most likely sleep deprived captain and crew, and an uncontrollable, violent crew member that the captain had never met before - If Captain Smith was, indeed, attacked - and if Pontius did, in fact, jump over the side, then, Smith should not be found guilty of manslaughter and should be exonerated by the court as he was by the US Coast Guard at the time of the incident three years ago. Were there there things that could have been done differently? Of course - but, hindsight is always 20-20.

Sorry, not buying it. You at least go back and look for the guy. Drag him through the water to wear him out if need be, but don’t just leave him to die. 

 

[Great Red Shark]

I didn't say to actually retrieve the guy, but you have to make it look like you tried

yep   "We searched and searched"    is difficult to offer when the GPS track is straight as an arrow

A swimmer would be difficult to consider as a risk, too - unless the captain can convince others that he could not put about safely after the MOB there's gonna be some 'splainin' to do.

I used to say to our the core crew that if your dumb ass fell off on a race between the islands you should swim toward the stern light because we were throwing your seabag off next,  "We're not carrying your shit around, this is a ULDB."   - To be clear,  this was just a dark JOKE. 

 

[nolatom]

Per the VI newspaper, trial starts this morning:

http://www.virginislandsdailynews.com/news/charter-captain-charged-in-death-of-crewmember-headed-to-trial/article_bd4efc52-e0e6-50f7-bc22-e2336e5299c4.html

So I subscribed to the V I Daily News.  Here's what reporter Suzanne Carlson relates:

Charter captain charged in death of crewmember headed to trial Monday

• By SUZANNE CARLSON Daily News Staff
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  https://www.virginislandsdailynews.com/users/profile/Suzanne Carlson
  
  Suzanne Carlson
  
  
  
  
  
  

[*]Jan 5, 2019

[*] 0

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ST. THOMAS — The trial of Capt. Richard Smith, the St. John charter captain charged in connection with a crewmember’s death, is scheduled to begin Monday in U.S. District Court.
Smith, owner of the 43-foot sailing vessel Cimarron, was charged Nov. 2 under what federal prosecutors described as the “Seaman’s Manslaughter Statute.”
Smith was charged in connection with the drowning of David Pontius, 54, of Beaufort, S.C., a crewmember who was helping transport the Cimarron from North Carolina to St. John for the winter charter season.
 



 
While a U.S. Coast Guard investigator found that Pontius jumped overboard in the midst of a violent psychotic episode and Smith was not at fault, federal prosecutors intend to present expert testimony that Smith was negligent in not seeking medical attention for Pontius before the fatal incident.
Through his attorneys, Michael Sheesley and David Cattie, Smith requested that the court allow defense expert Stephen Richter, a captain and marine consultant, to testify remotely, to avoid the cost of flying him to the territory. Smith said that fighting the charges against him has caused him to deplete his savings and borrow money from friends and family in an attempt to pay his attorneys.
U.S. District Judge Curtis Gomez denied that request, and Smith reiterated the request in court filings Friday.
Prosecutors have argued that Smith is not indigent and should bear the full cost of transporting Richter to the territory to testify in court, and cited a GoFundMe site set up by his daughter that’s collected a little over $4,000.
Cattie responded with a sharply worded motion, arguing that he and Sheesley are working “at a wildly discounted rate and Smith is in arrears” to his attorneys, and that prosecutors are engaging in needless prosecution and have driven his client to financial ruin.
 



 
“Government’s counsel has no idea what a defense costs in federal court because the United States uses taxpayer money to prosecute people like Smith. Perhaps government’s counsel should assess what it has spent prosecuting this frivolous case and determine if government’s counsel would have assets sufficient to defend himself before falsely asserting that Smith is not indigent. Smith is indigent because the United States made him so (despite the fact that the Coast Guard has already concluded that Smith acted appropriately),” Cattie wrote.
Cattie also filed a supplemental motion citing a section of federal law requiring that funds be allocated “to individuals when necessary for experts even when that defendant has retained private counsel.”
On Friday, Assistant U.S. Attorney Sigrid Tejo-Sprotte also filed a motion asking Gomez to block defense attorneys from referencing a report by U.S. Coast Guard investigator Lt. Jacob Hopper, who found that Pontius’ death was an accident.
Hopper is “not qualified to give an opinion as to what caused the death of David Pontius,” according to prosecutors, and “the Court should not permit defense counsel to argue or make reference to the Lt. Hopper’s report, knowing that its contents and conclusion is likely not admissible,” according to the motion.
Cattie fired back, calling prosecutors’ arguments “patently ridiculous” and writing that “the United States is aware that it is pursuing a frivolous case against Richard Smith, so it is seeking to limit or preclude his defense in this case,” according to a response filed Friday afternoon. “Because the evidence is damning to the United States’ case, it seeks to preclude the defense from referring to the contents of Lt. Jacob Hopper’s investigative report or its conclusions. Fortunately, the law explicitly permits the admission of both Lt. Hopper’s factual findings and the conclusions in his report.”
 



 
 


— Contact Suzanne Carlson at 340-714-9122 or email [email protected].

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