Why don't more young people get into cruising?...

Steam Flyer

Sophisticated Yet Humble
45,462
10,222
Eastern NC
They're kids. They're the ones on the downhill side of the equation; if they have lost the desire for our approval then it's because we've never given them enough to show it's worth, or in all too many cases abdicated completely.

I disagree with you on this. IMO far too many get unconditional approval far too early and too often. Then it becomes worthless, so why should they seek it?

It's like respect. You don't get respect, you earn respect.

As for kids being lazy, unmotivated, sullen, insolent and plain disobedient - I certainly was. And cunning with it, so as not to get caught.

That's why I became a software designer.

I hope that my post(s) aren't just more of the same-o same-o "kids today are long-haired lazy ingrates" etc etc. For one thing, I'm not a parent so I'm the closest to an impartial observer, here.

There is certainly too much 'participation award' kind of approval being handed out. It's worthless and most of the ones receiving it know it's worthless. That's not what I'm talking about.

A lot of us take for granted the kind of supportive family environment that we grew up with/provided... as far as I can tell, it's the exception rather than the rule. Parents these days are under a lot of outside pressures and many/most CANNOT provide that even if they knew how. The kids I've been dealing with in the various programs I volunteer in, don't have much adult contact other than their teachers (classrooms of 40 kids). Then there are the hardship cases, where parents are in jail or such.
 

Ajax

Super Anarchist
14,999
3,281
Edgewater, MD
Junior officers in the navy could not survive without "NORPs." (Naval Officer Rest Period).

I would often bring paperwork to my division officer for signature, to find him face down at his desk in his stateroom.
 

Bull City

A fine fellow
7,196
2,835
North Carolina
Youth Sports:
I'm part of an Over-60 men's soccer group. We play Tuesdays & Thursdays at 7:15 AM, which allows some guys who are still employed to play, and it's during school so we don't have competition for the field.

This morning, there were a dozens of high school age boys, parents, coaches, etc. when we got to the field. They were part of a massive youth soccer tournament. They had a game at 8:00 AM! People from Kentucky, Texas, and other states were there.

It's a f**king school day! Plus they were traveling all day yesterday, just to get here. That's two school days missed for a soccer tournament!

We didn't get to play, so I am a very grumpy old man.

I am not against youth sports - our children played soccer - but I do think these programs have gotten out of hand. They have become all-consuming of time and money. As of a few years ago, youth sports was a $20 billion business. Tournaments, practices, and games take place on holidays and these commitments often make family vacations impossible. How can parents find time and perhaps the money for sailing or cruising?
 

Israel Hands

Super Anarchist
3,189
1,871
coastal NC
Youth Sports:
I'm part of an Over-60 men's soccer group. We play Tuesdays & Thursdays at 7:15 AM, which allows some guys who are still employed to play, and it's during school so we don't have competition for the field.

This morning, there were a dozens of high school age boys, parents, coaches, etc. when we got to the field. They were part of a massive youth soccer tournament. They had a game at 8:00 AM! People from Kentucky, Texas, and other states were there.

It's a f**king school day! Plus they were traveling all day yesterday, just to get here. That's two school days missed for a soccer tournament!

We didn't get to play, so I am a very grumpy old man.

I am not against youth sports - our children played soccer - but I do think these programs have gotten out of hand. They have become all-consuming of time and money. As of a few years ago, youth sports was a $20 billion business. Tournaments, practices, and games take place on holidays and these commitments often make family vacations impossible. How can parents find time and perhaps the money for sailing or cruising?
It's a problem. I wish I had some of the $$ back that we spent for the kids' sports, and that we had spent more time sailing. But then again, it was what their friends were doing, so hard to escape.
 

Kris Cringle

Super Anarchist
3,284
2,918
How do parents find time and perhaps the money for sailing or cruising?

I'm glad you split the two, they are different animals.

My first recollection; used sporting gear (probably you did too).

But in the scheme of sailing, its cost when you've got kids in school is 'doable'. At least it was for us 15 or so years ago.

But sailing was done on a budget (like everything was for us raising kids). I bought my first new sail when the kids got out of college (thank god for Bacon used sails!). But we sailed every season in Vermont and Maine.

On finding time during school athletic years, we were lucky. Tennis, hockey(field and ice), ski racing, mt bike racing, while we did it all they never cut much into the sailing season and never on weekends(during the sailing season).

Cruising with kids, that's different than seasonal family sailing. If you're off long term with school-aged kids you must be home-schooling and likely running your own athletic program, or not.

Football (soccer) is crazy popular right now. My in-laws had a rabbid soccer player son in Brooklyn. It ran their life for a few years.

Now it is running his life as a freshman in college. It's a long road, kids,...
 
A long time ago, age 22 and having been hopelessly addicted to sailing for a few years at that point, I was determined to do an ocean crossing. Fresh out of college, I flew to Honolulu, where yachts were gathering for the 1980 Pan Am Clipper Cup race series.

As a complete amateur with only modest racing experience and limited offshore (all coastal) miles, I walked the docks and found a berth for the race series within a couple of hours. The relationships I minted aboard that boat I still have to this day!

After the series, I had to find a ride back to the west coast and achieve my first blue water passage. So I figured I'd start on maxi boat row, and work my way down. Without too much effort, I scored a berth aboard a well-known maxi yacht for the delivery to the mainland.

I was provided a bunk and sustenance in exchange for hard work, and I was stoked! I had to put up with a super-competent-but-not-very-friendly skipper, and a total prick of a first mate (both veterans of the Whitbread 'Round the World Race, the latter aboard Flyer, the winner). As much as I couldn't stand the mate, my watch mate was a great guy, and I still would have paid for the experience. It was a trade that felt like I got the better end of the deal.

The thought of being able to find a berth for a big race series, and easily getting a berth on a well-known maxi for a long delivery just by walking the docks, in this day and age, seems almost outlandish. Or not? I guess I'm not sure.

Upon arrival in San Francisco, I was offered a full-time paid position by the skipper of the maxi boat, which I would decline. That summer spent hanging with yachties- mostly pros and amateurs looking to become pro- allowed me to experience an epiphany sometime during the delivery back to the west coast: that my destiny was to be a yacht owner, not a yacht employee. I've never looked back or regretted my decision. To the pros, sailing is a job; it is work. And any time I'm aboard a boat with a pro, they are "at work." Ironically, I notice most of them don't really seem to derive much joy or seem to like their "work" any longer, as sailing is a job, not a recreational activity.

But not me. Sailing still gives me complete joy, and all I ever want is to be on the water. I don't know a single professional sailor who feels this way. Perhaps once they did, but their choice of livelihood quashed that sentimentalism completely, IMO.

So I settled into a conventional career in the financial services sector, lived a fairly conventional (boring?) life, raised a family, blah blah blah. In my scenario, the thought of leaving "the World" behind to go cruising, was a pipe dream- something that would have to be deferred for decades.

I still found a way to own 5 sailboats, buying my first (a J-24, see below) in 1981. Just retired after a 42 year career and have a new cruising boat being built for me in France. There's much to look forward to as the next many years will be on the water; I'm as giddy and excited as a child on Christmas eve!

This is one perspective as to "why young people don't get into cruising."

Scan_20151217.jpg
 

Fah Kiew Tu

Curmudgeon, First Rank
10,420
3,503
Tasmania, Australia
To the pros, sailing is a job; it is work. And any time I'm aboard a boat with a pro, they are "at work." Ironically, I notice most of them don't really seem to derive much joy or seem to like their "work" any longer, as sailing is a job, not a recreational activity.

This is often the case. Turning a passion for something into a way of earning a living often kills the passion. Not always, but often.

I was fortunate enough to find a niche where I could get paid to go play in the deep ocean on big ships with expensive toys. When they were going to stop me going to sea on medical grounds, I quit and made some decent 'fuck you' money in software.

Flip side I've had a lifelong interest in and enthusiasm for machine tools. I could easily set up & run a bespoke engineering/machining biz. But I know what'd happen, so I'll never do that. My big toy collection is there so I can build stuff I want - and so I built a steel sailboat, giving me another big toy to play with.

But I'm far from young now, of course.

FKT
 
Earlier this year, I read an article explaining the science behind the perception of time moving faster the older we get, and contrarily, how slow time seems to move when we're younger. I forget how it works but it was an interesting article that instigated an "Ah ha!" moment.....and now I've forgotten the explanation......ha ha
 

Bull City

A fine fellow
7,196
2,835
North Carolina
Earlier this year, I read an article explaining the science behind the perception of time moving faster the older we get, and contrarily, how slow time seems to move when we're younger. I forget how it works but it was an interesting article that instigated an "Ah ha!" moment.....and now I've forgotten the explanation......ha ha
If you remember the article, and remember where you can find us, please point us to it. :D

Thanks!
 

Israel Hands

Super Anarchist
3,189
1,871
coastal NC
It's mathematically pretty simple. When you are 6, for example, the past year represents 17% percent of your life - a "long time." Especially since you are learning new things at an increasing rate, and you are growing steadily. The past year has really been something in your life. When you are 60, the past year was just 1.7% of your life, another year collected along with your half-century of memories, which seems like almost nothing.
 

Bull City

A fine fellow
7,196
2,835
North Carolina
It's mathematically pretty simple. When you are 6, for example, the past year represents 17% percent of your life - a "long time." Especially since you are learning new things at an increasing rate, and you are growing steadily. The past year has really been something in your life. When you are 60, the past year was just 1.7% of your life, another year collected along with your half-century of memories, which seems like almost nothing.
OK, so how come when I'm watching a soccer game, for example, and my team is one goal ahead and there's 10 minutes left, and time's passage turns into cold molasses?
 

Israel Hands

Super Anarchist
3,189
1,871
coastal NC
OK, so how come when I'm watching a soccer game, for example, and my team is one goal ahead and there's 10 minutes left, and time's passage turns into cold molasses?
And how come an enjoyable hour, like just now exercising the engine, seems like a moment? I guess it’s true that some time things are unexplainable. 🤔
1670778611949.jpeg
 

robtoujours

Communist
655
421
Undercover
It's mathematically pretty simple. When you are 6, for example, the past year represents 17% percent of your life - a "long time." Especially since you are learning new things at an increasing rate, and you are growing steadily. The past year has really been something in your life. When you are 60, the past year was just 1.7% of your life, another year collected along with your half-century of memories, which seems like almost nothing.
Hmm seems legit.

Ok, how about answering why sleeping late in the morning is so much more pleasant when I have multiple boat projects to finish before lunchtime??
 

L Dip

New member
I was kind of hoping this would turn into the "camp cruising", "micro cruising" or "dingy cruising" thread thread rather than the generational angst thread. Oh well, probably should have picked a better title. I have enjoyed the banter anyhow. :)

For the winter the sabot is getting a new fore deck glassed in (previous owner did not use marine ply and it was starting to delaminate) as well as a skeg added because running it up on rocky beaches all summer sure did a number on the hull. The trailer is getting some much needed upgrades to ease loading and increase durability. I have also built a new tow bike with a super granny gear from an old '90s mtb frame I had laying around. This will open up some interesting new launching options that were previously inaccessible (including a sweet fishing lake) because towing a 90lb boat up a hill is no joke.

I am also looking at larger trailer dinghys if the right vessel presents itself this year. Pickings are a bit slim in my area but I did come across a paceship peregrine 16. Information online is pretty scarce. I would be interested if anyone knows if they were considered stable daysailers or more racing oriented boats.
 

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