Young and Full of Promise

[IanA.]

What material are you using for the mast track (manufacturer and part number)?

Hi, it's a custom extrusion in 6061 T6 aluminum that is heat treated and then hardcoat anodized. It has a very similar profile to the Antal HS22 profile but is much lighter due to thinner sections all around. The bolt rope diameter is 8mm and it will accept HS22 cars and sliders perfectly. This track is also 1 piece (12m long) which for my case means no joins for the entire length. 

 

[chris foiler]

You are doing a great job . I would have loved that mast track extrusion for my mast but  not easy to get in North America can’t even get antal hs22 and it is almost 1/4 the weight of my mast .

 

[IanA.]

You are doing a great job . I would have loved that mast track extrusion for my mast but  not easy to get in North America can’t even get antal hs22 and it is almost 1/4 the weight of my mast .

Not hard to chop up into 3 or 4 metre sections and send out west but maybe easier to source from the Hall NZL boys as they should have some stockpile. PM me if you need contacts.

 

[chris foiler]

True but like you I wanted one piece if possible so am going with alloy bolt rope extrusion.

 

[IanA.]

 

[Irrational 14]

Looking good. How are you isolating all that aluminum from the carbon?

 

[IanA.]

Honestly the hard coat anodizing does a really good job all on its own. Most mast composite mast builders just rely on anodizing and tef-gel for these parts. In my case I added on extra step of brushing a layer of duralac(green) on all the mating surfaces and let cure(about 48 hours) before installing with tef-gel. 

 

[allweather]

Wow, that is pretty nice to hear that it is now a little less complicated when it comes to mounting hardware on carbon masts.

Simple tef-gel and monel rivets work too? That brings it down to about as easy to use as aluminium masts. Nice.

 

[IanA.]

Tef-gel is a great product but it is not forever. Anything that has tef-gel as the main stop for corrosion may need to be serviced every 3-5 years depending.

I've avoided monel rivets for the lack of serviceability. For the fasteners i've used heli-coils in 304 which are wound into the mast wall with green duralac. The the fasteners (all A4-70 except main halyard sheave-box are A4-80) then go in with tef-gel. 

You can get special heli-coils that have a primer coating that should negate installing with duralac but they are mighty expensive and I already had all the different goo at home to do it myself. 

Unless you go full titanium on everything, corrosion and oxidation will always be an uphill battle. That's why I just try and keep things as easy as possible to service when it's needed. 

 

[allweather]

Threaded is so much nicer.(when possible)

funny that you mention serviceability, I‘m about to drill out the rivets of my mast foot/base to see if the infernal knocking sound comes from there. (Redid everything during the winter, and a club mate pointed out that that was about 20C colder than now. Which makes some sense considering it happens on a windless night too, when its cooling drastically compared to the sun)

I do wonder if I could tap the aluminium base... but I digress! 

If I had the tools for helicoils I‘d gladly use them just about everywhere. As is I try to source A4 inserts whenever I can. Expensive though. Very much agree on easy servicing regardless of how it‘s done. Drilling out rivets is a pain. 

 

[IanA.]

Threaded is so much nicer.(when possible)

funny that you mention serviceability, I‘m about to drill out the rivets of my mast foot/base to see if the infernal knocking sound comes from there. (Redid everything during the winter, and a club mate pointed out that that was about 20C colder than now. Which makes some sense considering it happens on a windless night too, when its cooling drastically compared to the sun)

I do wonder if I could tap the aluminium base... but I digress! 

If I had the tools for helicoils I‘d gladly use them just about everywhere. As is I try to source A4 inserts whenever I can. Expensive though. Very much agree on easy servicing regardless of how it‘s done. Drilling out rivets is a pain. 

That's the beauty of composite masts in that you can add localized patching to increase wall thickness for threaded fasteners. You could try adding backing plates for threading but then your just adding weight and complexity. I'm sure monel rivets and duralac will be totally fine for your purposes and should last many many years.

Anyways, I found these guys which seem to be the cheapest for quality German made thread kits. Nothing is cheap with boat projects but try to save a dollar where you can.

https://www.voelkel-shop.com/en/v-coil.html?gclid=Cj0KCQjwm6KUBhC3ARIsACIwxBi6swjIzKaWmJRK3O-UWky5AJobFlR4YObigP-7ShQRBZLKKG8efZwaAioWEALw_wcB

 

[giegs]

Thank you for documenting all your efforts and sharing some of your thinking on why this instead of that type questions. Caught up on this thread over the last week and am thoroughly impressed with the quality of your work, especially as it's in 'free time' while juggling family, a child, and whatever other responsibilities.

And your disdain for shoes is shared.

 

[allweather]

You could try adding backing plates for threading but then your just adding weight and complexity. I'm sure monel rivets and duralac will be totally fine for your purposes and should last many many years.

Yep, last time was 15 or so years... I also confirmed it's not the rivets, the forestay simple is too long(mistake measuring in the winter, urgh) and needs replacing so that the mast is a bit more straight. Shame, it sailed extremely well the way it was...

Interesting thing about the mast base, it is actually cast aluminium with 4-5mm thickness... But I'll simply put the rivets in again.(would have done this weekend, but make a guess who had the rivets fall out of the bag in their driveway and didn't notice until at the club?)

Anyway, thank you for the link. The pricing seems... tolerable. Especially when I compare to a well sized riveting tool too... Helicoil availability is just better too. Something for the future, all the hardware in the deck I'd rather get rid off the nuts.

 

[IanA.]

Have had a bit on! Our second little girl finally decided to join us after holding out as long as possible in my wife's belly. My own time for boat projects is of course limited for the moment but some things are still going on in the background. So at least we can keep some momentum going.

The sailing team is coming together..

 

[IanA.]

By the way, do you know how much a Harken spin pole car set costs? Way to much!  

Anyways I already had a 22mm car... so I just just took an off the shelf ring from Rontan and did a bit of cutting and forging to fit it. 2x M8 bolts tapped in place.

I think it's a touch lighter then the stock kit from Harken which is good since I didn't budget for this at all in the total rig weight as it was a bit of a last minute call. 

 

[allweather]

so I just just took an off the shelf ring from Rontan and did a bit of cutting and forging to fit it. 2x M8 bolts tapped in place.

Congratulations on the successful acquisition, looks pretty neat for a DIY job with parts you had around.

Oh, and the kid is nice too.
She will take most of the attention I am sure.

 

[Snowden]

By the way, do you know how much a Harken spin pole car set costs? Way to much!  

Given the focus on weight to date I had expected you would go with one or two fixed rings rather than a track for the inboard end of the pole. Is the idea to allow a wider range of spi configs (including asyms)?

 

[IanA.]

Starting to mock up the front end of the bowsprit. This is all just temporary parts to help me figure out what i'm trying to accomplish. Will keep tinkering until I'm happy..

 

[IanA.]

Given the focus on weight to date I had expected you would go with one or two fixed rings rather than a track for the inboard end of the pole. Is the idea to allow a wider range of spi configs (including asyms)?

That's a pretty spot on assumption! 

This all came about as I have spent more time digging into to sail plans for the different racing/ rating configurations. For offshore/semi-crewed, we are gonna have to look seriously at Assym's off a spin pole. 

I think for buoy racing we will stick with symmetricals so I have built out two different poles for each setup. One is optimized to suit end for end gybing while to other has a specific outboard and inboard end suited for Assyms. 

In this case, the adjustable car/ring will be worth it for optimizing the range of sail shapes we might end up chasing. 

Below is the one I just built out to be used with end for end gybes. The Assym/dip pole version is already finished but its covered up and stored in the rafters currently..

I'm just whipping up a quick sock cover for this one now. 

 

[IanA.]

I'm sort of hitting all the low hanging fruit like these random splicing jobs and whatever else can be started and finished somewhat quickly.

Here are the runners slapped together (5mm sk99 Maffioli) as well as the code-0 furling system put all together and ready to go. Most of these odd jobs aren't mission critical but it's something I can do in the meantime anyways.